Can’t We Just Be Friends? What Amber Rose & Lil’ Duval’s Twitter Convo Says About Male-Female Friendships
This morning Amber Rose went on a bit of a Twitter rant. Apparently, she’s tired of being dogged out by bloggers, comedians, and people at large for being seen with so many men.
She tweeted:
“Morning Twit Fam, [I] didn’t really wake up in a good mood today. I’m just so sick of being ridiculed. [People] assuming things without knowing. I’m super nice to everyone I meet. I’m a very caring compassionate person. I don’t deserve to be talked about so negatively. I really hate explaining myself that’s why I stay so quiet but I will say this….. I was with my ex for 2 years and now I have a new Love. [Two People] that’s it. If that makes me a whore then so be it. I have NEVER slept with Fabolous, Drake, Chris Brown, Amare, Lebron, Cassidy etc nor have I ever been a Prostitute”
While Rose makes it clear she has never been a prostitute and is not promiscuous, she has been very open about her past in Philly, where she worked as a stripper to make ends meet.
Moreover, despite her claim that she hasn’t been boyfriend hopping—she was famously with Kanye West for two years and is now dating Wiz Khalifa—Amber has been photographed on the arms of some of hip-hop and sport’s elite since parting ways with the Louis Vutton Don. Because of her popularity and how the media seems to hype a celebrity’s every move, Amber has been labeled a whore and a gold digger by those who don’t even know her. And according to “comedian” Lil’ Duval, it’s all her fault.
“No disrespect, but that’s what comes [with] being around so many different men,” Lil Duval tweeted.” “In our mind if [you are] with him [you] f***ed him. In this world, it’s not about what you think you are, it’s about what people SEE [you] as and it’s up to you to make them see what you see. You’ll see what I’m [tryin] to say later on. [I'm] not bashing you. Just understand [that] you are what’s perceived in this industry.”
And there it is.
Women who have a lot of male friends have been dealing with this very issue for years. If we dare have a large circle of comrades and a good amount of them are male, many people become suspicious and we are labeled as “hoes.” On the flip side, men who have a lot of female friends are just popular.
Although I cannot stand Lil’ Duval and his brand of “comedy,” his argument that Amber has to deal with people labeling her as easy because she’s seen on the arms of men is quite standard.
Growing up I had a lot of male friends. My father was a basketball coach, I had an older brother, and I was somewhat of a lipstick tomboy. When I was younger I felt more at ease discussing basketball stats and rappers than talking about the latest fashion trends, so my crew consisted mostly of dudes, which was never a problem until I got to high school.
In high school, having male friends somehow meant you were boy crazy and fast, and some questioned whether or not I was really hanging with the boys just to talk sports. They falsely insinuated, just like Lil’ Duval, that women and men could not possibly hang out with one another without getting it on.
Like most people, I don’t know who Amber Rose has or has not slept with, but that hasn’t stopped many from calling her 50 million hoes.
But why?
Why do some of us hold on to such rigid ideals about male-female relationships? And why are we SO comfortable judging celebrities based on gossip and innuendo?
Every time I think I’ve left the childishness and ignorance of high school behind, I’m reminded that some things—hurling irrational insults, treating gossip as fact, and making snap judgments about others—are just really hard to grow out of.
What do you think about Amber Rose and Lil’ Duval’s conversation? Let’s talk about it!
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I think it is dumb as fawk to assume if a woman and man are hanging out together then they must be dating or having sex with each other.
I was just talking about something like this where if a woman is with a man and another man wants to talk to her, he’ll first ask the man ‘Is this you?’ as to immediately assume the woman is dating the man when they may very well just be friends.
I think that was a decent response to Amber who needs a reality check. Why this attempt to appear demure and respectful is questionable at this time when her appearance on fashion/gossip blogs is waning. How dare she TRY to convince me that all those nasty…hoochie shots of her are somehow Rated-G!
Thousands of women are f*cking 24/7 to be associated with a Bum Star aka Rap Star. She knows the deal. I’ve never said this b4 but…..HOE SIT DOWN! (smiles)
cosign.
“I think that was a decent response to Amber who needs a reality check. ”
My best friends are still men- as we grow older, there have been run ins with both sides: girlfriends, boyfriends.
There are the unfair ways of the woman world:
- a woman wearing 4 inch stilettos and a short skirt gets little sympathy (from both sides of the gender spectrum) for being sexually harassed
- a woman cuddly and attached to several men (who could very well all be just friends) gets similar treatment
Let’s not feign naivety.
@ MW: I don’t understand your comment. The world is unfair to women therefore we should enforce, not challenge, the status quo? Really? Really?
welp what he said is true but that don’t make it right……but then again i guess im a lipstick tomboy like u. Especially if the female is attractive its n unwarranted catch 22.
Great article/post. This has been a hot topic lately in my own personal life. I had a “friend” tell me we could never be together ’cause I had to many male friends. Apparently, he thinks that just because I have more male friends, I’m either starved for attention or I’ve slept with them all. To me, sounds like he’s just insecure. Folks need to know the difference between a “hoe” and a sociable woman who just happens to have more men friends than women. And so what if she’s sleeping with them? That’s between her and those men.
Great topic. First let me say that Amber knows what she’s doing. I don’t knock anyone’s hustle but ma’am, please you can spare me the crying when you became famous for being a famous man’s girlfriend. Now I’m not saying that she was looking to get famous and that’s why she dealt with Kanye, but truth be told she likes the attention of the media and she’s never met a camera lens she didn’t like. But with that said, she does make a valid point and raise an important question. The one I also posed on my blog, recently. Can attractive men and women be “just friends”? If she was flickin’ it up with Biz Markie I’m sure people would just label it a photo opp. Yet when she’s photo’d next to these young, eligible, and successful (monetarily so) men, people will call what they think is a spade a spade. She can knock off the wa wa wa-in’ and go film the reality show she GOT from being someone’s shorty, but I’m still left pondering the male female “friendship” question…
I totally agree. And I think Miss Amber wants us to forget that the reason these dudes want to be photographed with her is to make it look like they’re b@nging her. Can’t get mad when it works.
There is def a double standard when it comes to having lots of male friends. But sadly, it is what it is. It’s an unevolved way of thinking. And any man who thinks that way is obviously small minded. And there are ALOT of small minded people in the world- so you just have to know how to handle them. That being stated, I have to somewhat agree with Lil’ Duval. As you become more mature, you realize that so much of human interaction is about preception not reality. And you have to be a master of crafting and controlling your self image. Lil’ Duval wrote “In this world, it’s not about what you think you are, it’s about what people SEE [you] as and it’s up to you to make them see what you see.” And I agree with him. It’s not fair- but it’s life. And often life isn’t fair.
If a guy has too many female friends:
He’s gay/insecure.
If a girl has too many male friends:
She’s a lesbian/whore.
I must be the greatest bisexual trick in the world =/.
-eyeroll-
Yeah. I am not liking any of the comments on this thread of that of the misogynist Lil’Duvall. I can’t believe people (women!) are agreeing with him.
Thank you, Lisa and Tomi, for speaking some sense on this thread. (You two ladies always seem to keep it real anyway.) I have several male friends, only one of whom I’ve ever dated or messed with. I always seem to find myself more relaxed and free-spirited hanging around my guy friends. Yet I also have several female friends – I just don’t hang out with them as regularly. I’m sure folks look at me like I have a lot of guy friends – and, honestly, it never dawned on me that (being an attractive, single woman) seen with several heterosexual male friends makes me look whorish or slutty. I guess I was living in a bubble. At any rate, if any man chooses to view me that way, I think that is his problem, and I ain’t got time to eff with an insecure and weak-minded guy like that anyway.
Amber should just do Amber: if she likes having guy friends, she should just do that and eff what people have to say. You can’t make people see you the way you see yourself – contrary to what some commenters have suggested. All you can do is be confident in yourself, be true to yourself, and realize that some people are always going to view you through their own warped version of reality. Nothing you can do, but give em the *kanye shrug* and keep it moving. While you can’t ignore the way others see you because it’s sometimes important (job interviews, etc.) you also can’t depend for validation on how others see you – that’s a sure road to depression and zoloft.
Finally, I beg to differ that just because something is the way of the world we simply have to accept it. (If that was the case, we black folks and women on this thread would still in somebody’s kitchen and cotton field. Grow some balls and ovaries, people! We come from a legacy of people who saw the world and thought, “It doesn’t have to be this way, and I can do something about that.” Not to go on a tangent.) I can’t believe how complacent so many of us are in this world. It’s sad.
@B
thank you for being the voice of reason in these comments! i whole-heartedly agree with you and i am seriously side-eyeing some of the people commenting.
I don’t assume any girl is promiscuous because she hangs out with a lot of guys. I don’t care about random people enough to be labeling them.
I think people label Amber because of three things: the way she dresses, the company she keeps and because she’s famous for nothing.
I’m not saying it’s right to label her for those reasons (although, personally, famous for nothing women are useless perpetuates of stereotypes and the declining state of young black girls), but that is how the world turns.
Such is life.
ive always had a lot of male friends growing up, but i was never been labelled a whore until i entered into a relationship with a very insecure girl who could not be convinced that i wasnt having sex with them. i decided that that was her problem, not mine, and i told her point blank that they were just friends, that she never saw anything inappropriate between us, and i wasnt getting rid of them… bros over hos. and when i said that if she didnt like it she could dip, she got over her insecurities and that was the end of that.
and as for men and women being friends, i think its totally possible, but you have to realize two things if youre going to be friends and friends only with a man: the first is that if youre moderately attractive and hes straight, hes going to think about fucking you. FACT. the second is, since hes probably going to think about fucking you, you should make it clear that he is in the friend zone and treat him accordingly. being labelled a whore, imo, is all in the way you interact with your ‘friends.’
im a very social person and have been labelled a flirt (the BIGGEST flirt in dc, even) because i enjoy hugging my guy friends, putting my arm around them, holding hands, etc, but ive never been labelled a whore because i never took it that extra step… i dont kiss my friends on the mouth, lay all over them on couches, grind up on them in the club, or hold that hug a touch too long (yall know what i mean).
amber rose has been photographed in compromising positions with her ‘friends,’ and thats why shes being called out. you dont make out with your friends (fab), you dont take pictures in the club with your hand all near your ‘friends’ crotch area (amare), and you dont get photographed making out with your ‘friends,’ either (chris brown). shes talking nonsense right now and lil duvall is speaking the truth: perception is everything in the industry she has chosen to be in and she is just not putting herself out there in a good light. teyana taylor and keri hilson are also friends with tons of dudes and i have never seen as much negative press surrounding them being a whore like amber rose… i wonder why?
ps: i agree with Tomi… the authors assumption that dudes with a lot of female friends are ‘just popular’ isnt one ive ever heard; i have a close male friend that has ZERO male friends and everybody thinks he’s gay (which hes not. he just gets along with females better).
Best comment by far!
I’m so very tired of women having to defend themselves against an abhorrent double standard. So what? So what if you have a lot of male friends. So what if you sleep with more than two men in three years? Why this is still a way to judge someone’s character is beyond me. I know why it benefits men to perpetuate this value system and I suspect many women buy into it because 1) it’s what they’ve been taught/shown and 2) it’s necessary to create an us v them, virgin v. ho dichotomy in order to appear better than other women. I don’t know really.
Just because Lil’ Duval’s view is popular or widely-held doesn’t make it right. By pointing out to Amber Rose how people view her and saying that’s just the way it is, he isn’t really doing anything but perpetuating the issue. Why not just say, “yeah, that’s wrong we continue to burden one another with this crap,” or not say anything at all?
Thank you!!!! I thought I was going out of my mind reading these ignorant comments.
im not using it to judge amber rose’s character and i think youre playing into the stereotype when you carry the belief that being labelled a whore is a remark on character. ive known plenty of hos that were ‘super nice to everyone’ and ‘very caring compassionate’ people. they had excellent characters. they were still hos. i think it would be smarter for amber rose to go the michelle rodriguez route and say, ‘these are my male friends. if i dont have sex with them, if i do have sex with them, if i have sex with them and thirty other men is my business and nobody elses. my sexual activities dont have anything to do with my character as a person.’ then we would be having an entirely different conversation. but using the old ‘its a double standard’ excuse is BS
serenissima, you’ve just shown us the double standard at work. That was just ignorant. What is a ho? Why aren’t men labeled hos? And don’t come with that tired “man-whore” argument either. The fact that the word ho is understood as female says it all. If there even is a definition for it, how do you know these women fit it? Where you in the bedroom with them, watching? If these young women were all that personality wise, why is their worth being based on assumed sexual trysts?
A lot of times women get slapped with labels by society based on innuedo or just foolishness. And I completely agree with Kia, it’s another way to make women compete and hold each other down. Crabs in a bucket for that elusive ring and so-called respectability.
I’m not delusional enough to say there is no double standard, but how am I perpetrating it? Because I believe Amber brought a lot of this on herself w/her behavior? We are all in control of our self-worth and to say her actions were totally blameless and place it all on a stereotypical society is insane to me. (Plus, Men ARE hos, too! Trey Songz brags about all the girls he’s slept with and in the very next breath will talk about his STDs. Is he a ho? Yes! Do I think that makes it okay for women to be hos, too? Hell no! And I’m sick and tired of women using the if-men-can-do-it-then-so-can-I excuse. Men have been getting syphilis for years, too. :-/)
I can only speak for myself on the definition of the word but, to me, ‘hos’ are bedhoppers who engage in excessive casual sexual behavior just because they are obsessed with using sex as a means to an end (be that end bragging rights/bedpost notches, cash, a career, whatever.) And idc if you’re black, white, man, woman or freaking Jesus Christ himself, if you’re running around putting it in anything that walks or taking it from anything that breathes, you’re probably a ho. Does that mean you’re a bad person, treat people badly, or deserve to have shit talked about you? No.
But Amber Rose DID essentially used sex (or at least a sex-driven image) to springboard her way into fame for no reason. Yeezy picked her up in the strip club and, as the article states, she has made no bones about talking about her past, dressing provocatively, or appearing in sexy magazine spreads, building her own ‘career’ outside of Mr. West. There is NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. She’s playing up her assets and making that money; however, all of that coupled with the many men she keeps company with have definitely painted a certain picture of her. You can’t deny that. And that image is everything, especially when you’re trying to be a public figure.
You could personally be the hardest working, sweetest, nicest, smartest person in the world, but would you show up to a job interview looking raggedy talking about, ‘Society isn’t going to dictate what you think of me based on the way I present myself?’ No! And she doesn’t present herself as being just friendly with a lot of these men. Plus were living in the digital age, where a photo and/or video is worth a thousand words, and Amber has never been camera shy. I understand that people probably want to take a picture with you, but did Amare say, ‘Hey, Amber, put your hand in my crotch, that would be hilarious’ and she just went with it? Did fab say ‘It would be really, really cool for you to appear naked in my video and make out with me’ and she just said, ‘sure,’ without any thought to the kind of press that would generate? Really? *side eye* Come on, son. Amber Rose is not stupid.
At the end of the day, she took the pictures, etc, and if she wants to be a celebrity then she (and many others) needs to make better personal choices, not blame a shady society. And if she doesn’t want these types of things to be discussed then it would be better for her to either state that her business is her business and keep it moving, and/or pick up some kind of talent for people to focus on so they could stop talking about her personal life so damn much.
‘If these young women were all that personality wise, why is their worth being based on assumed sexual trysts?’
This is the million dollar question. Having sex, a lot or a little, does not determine your worth. They are mutually exclusive. Amber Rose being labelled anything by anybody other than herself doesn’t determine her worth, but she doesn’t seem to think so and showed that (as well as answering your question herself) when she chose to address the vitriol she felt was being spewed about her. That made it relevant and that made it okay for the media to continue to banter about her worth by way of her sexual partners instead of her personality, because it showed that she herself is comparing her worth to her sexual trysts (both assumed and real). Is that right? No. But that’s the society we live in and this is the life she chose to have.
Everyone in this thread should watch ‘The Contender.’
I think one of the things that is missing from this discussion, at least when it comes to Amber Rose and her response to Duval, is that a lot of these dudes are ASKING to take pics with her. She replied to him, that when he met her, he asked if he could be photographed with her, and she agreed because she is a fan (uggh!, can’t stand that dude). But seriously, in the world of celebrity, things are different. Duval is just as much of an attention seeker as Amber Rose and so is Reggie Bush, and a bunch of other male celebs….but she catches all the flack. They accuse her of sleeping with them but they don’t catch nearly as much shade as she does even though it would take two to tango.
I believe part of the reason is that she did become famous for being with Kanye, but that was due to the blogs and razzi wanted to take a pic of the racially ambiguous woman on Kanye’s arm, who was thick, and bald headed. Then people found out she was a stripper and then she really became a target.
I am not a “fan” of Amber Rose, but I don’t think she should be knocked for doing the same thing that all of these other guys taking pics with her do. I also don’t think that it is fair for her to be scoffed at because she used to be a stripper. I think that is where a lot of it comes from.
I understand that the underlying issue here is the double standards set forth by being in a predominantly patriarchal society, BUT the one thing that really broke my heart was the fact that she is dating WHIZ KHALIFA. I just did not see that one coming, but I guess opposites do attract. Carry on with the conversation!
Anytime two celebs are snapped arm in arm, the media asks if they’re an “item.” When they go out to dinner, that ups the ante to sightings of them “canoodling.” When they hit a red carpet together, they might as well scream “We’re sleeping together,” whether it is true or not.
I’ve only seen Amber “on the arm” of Kanye, Drake, and Wiz Khalifa. She’s right to be upset with folks calling a whore for DATING. She’s naive, however, if she’s sincerely shocked by it, though. Apparently, men get props for their relationships and women just get slammed. And don’t think her stripper past is the root of it. I saw several blogs trying to dog Rihanna out for the same thing! The only difference was that they tried to call her a “ho” because she has her own money. Amber has been called a straight up “whore.”
It would be funny if we could all have the tally of our sex partners on our foreheads for just one week. Maybe the slut shaming would stop.
Happens in the workplace everyday. You don’t even have to hang with lots of guys. If you talk to one guy for longer than 5 minutes you’re bound to get a side-eye.
IMO Amber hangin with all her guy friends and being photographed with them is probly emotional warfare against her boyfriend at that time. Chicks play all kinds of games. I agree with Duval that the perception will always be negative for a woman with that fast girl image.
serenissima i could not agree more with our coment. i feel that is what feminism has got to competing with men. it does not mean it is a good thing.
There are lines in Kanye West’s song “Stronger” that leave me thinking of Amber Rose:
“Heard they’d do anything for a Klondike
Well I’d do anything for a blonde-dyke
And she’ll do anything for the limelight
And we’ll do anything when the time’s right”
What I know about Amber is that she is a blonde bi-sexual who loves the media spotlight.
I am wondering if Kanye was possibly talking about her in his song before they made their relationship public……….
Blah, blah, blah!! If a women has lots of men around her the title put on her is she’s sleeping with all of them, but if a man has lots of women around him he is a player/pimp/dog and is also sleeping with them. So please dont twist the story and say he’s considered cool. He maybe considered cool to his friends as Im sure the girl who has lots of male friends is looked up to by her friends as cool.
Next, what is the reason for a man/women to be hanging around lots of men especially if they are in the lime light????