Black Students At Duke Upset Over New Study Claiming They Take the Easy Way Out
College can be a difficult time. Not only are many trying to “find themselves,” but students are also forced to decide on what career path their lives will take. Because of this, many students often switch majors in an attempt to figure out what works best for them. While this practice may be common place, a new research paper at Duke University has some black student crying foul.
An unpublished report titled “What Happens After Enrollment? An Analysis of the Time Path of Racial Differences in GPA and Major Choice,” took a look at Duke’s 2001 and 2002 freshman classes, and concluded that black students switched to “easier” majors at disproportionally higher rates than their white counterparts.
The Herald Sun reports:
It found that among students who initially expressed an interest in majoring in economics, engineering and the natural sciences, 54 percent of black men and 51 percent of black women ended up switching to the humanities or another social science.
By comparison, 33 percent of white women and just 8 percent of white men made the switch to majors that are considered less rigorous, require less study and have easier grading standards.
According to the paper, 68 percent of Duke’s black students but less than 55 percent of white students ended up majoring in the humanities or social sciences other than economics.
The paper’s authors–professors Peter Arcidiacono and Kenneth Spenner, and graduate student Esteban Aucejo–suggest that the switch to seemingly less rigorous majors suggest that black students who benefit from affirmative-action programs are less prepared for more difficult majors, and therefore switch to less demanding areas of study. They also argue that “attempts to increase representation [of minorities] at elite universities through the use of affirmative action may come at a cost of perpetuating underrepresentation of blacks in the natural sciences and engineering,”
According to the Herald Sun, the report was submitted as a brief to the U.S. Supreme Court by opponents of affirmative action. It argues that previous data showing the GPAs of black students were similar to their white peers aren’t necessarily accurate because black students, according to report’s authors, tended to pursue less difficult areas of study.
Black students at Duke are pushing back against the paper’s findings, which also noted that children of alumni switched majors at similar rates. The Black Student Alliance (BSA) sent a letter to the local NAACP branch about the ramifications of the research paper.
The BSA explains, “The implications and intentions of this research at the hands of our very own prestigious faculty, seemingly without a genuine concern for proactively furthering the well-being of the black community is hurtful and alienating.”
The BSA also noted that the paper neglected “to account for the societal, complex and institutional factors that must be considered in any attempt to delineate trends in racial differences in grade point averages and major choices, in a scholarly manner.”
What do you think? Does this information speak to the validity of Affirmative-Action or are the paper’s authors just race-bating?
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and they needed to do a study on this because………………………………………..
The research sounds on track to me. It is true that the majority of Black engineers and Black doctors finish at HBC.
I don’t think the authors of this paper are “race-bating”. In fact, the paper is quite true. How many Black students, if you went to/work at a non-HBCU, do you know that are actually NOT in some easy ass major?
I go to Penn State, am of African descent, and I am a French-Business Option major. Besides myself, I believe there is only one other Black [female] majoring in French. And not only that, as I take my business classes, I am the only, or one of the couple, Black student in my classes!
Then I turn around and see all my Black friends and associates here ALL in the Communications College, or majoring in BBH (Biobehavioral Health). Then there’s the handfuls of Blacks in the Business School (one of the top in the country). And I probably can’t even name one person that is Black that is majoring in Engineering, or even Criminal Justice (aka CLJ here @ PSU). And there’s other majors that I can really only name one Black person, I have a friend who’s in an Agricultural major, and another that’s in one of the IT majors.
I also have friends who have left their previous majors of CLJ and Economics to be in the Communications dept. And frankly, yes, I do believe they took the easy way out.
Black people are always complaining about progress and whatnot. Why not stop complaining and go to school for something that will actually benefit your community? Quit tryna aspire to be on tv, radio and in films, even though we do need our race in those fields. Instead let’s go into engineering – chemical, aerospace, civil or mechanical – get into the languages, even if it’s just a minor, major in education, business, agriculture, criminal justice, earth sciences and architecture!
Black folk: Stop taking the easy road in life. Life isn’t an easy road. Plain and simple.
PS. And sometimes all these HBCUs aren’t even the best choices in education. If you wanna be something, go to where you will be given the best education. So what if there aren’t alot or even one other Black person at that place. Be diverse, be open to other cultures. Stop being so stuck in your ways and open your mind to the world, because once you do, so many opportunities will be available to you. SMH
Mimi, what do you mean stop taking the easy way out? French and Business is not the same as Engineering, so I’m not sure where you were trying to go with that. It seems like you chose a major that you found interesting and you felt you would excel in, I don’t think you should knock others for doing the same. As for this article, the bottom line is college is about finding yourself and ultimately you want to choose a career that you will enjoy and be successful in. Hard work will come regardless of what field you go into. That’s just life. Instead of focusing on the fact that Black students are switching their majors, how about focus on the fact that more and more Black students are going to college and attaining a degree. People always find a way to make a negative out of something positive. SMDH
Michelle,
Never did I compare French and Business to Engineering, uh not sure where you got that from. I wrote that I am the only, or 1 of 2 Black persons in my major. I also wrote the majors in which I see the Black students choosing at my campus.
And honestly, I chose French because I was familiar with it having took it in high school. And I chose the business option of that major because I messed up my freshman yr and would not have been able to get into Penn State’s business school. Had I really pursued my heart, I probably wouldn’t be here. But it was determination that made me continue to finish.
There’s is only a bit of truth in your statement about more and more Black students going to college. However, those same Black kids going to college will be some of the majority of those that don’t FINISH college because they don’t have the money for it, maybe don’t even have the determination and just fail and have to withdraw from school.
I’m not trying to be negative about anything, I’m just trying to point out what I see, and give suggestion on how to make it better, what to do so that the next paper talks about how less Black students than White students switch to easier majors.
But everyone is entitled to their own opinion as I am. Thankssss.
P.S.S. About comparing the GPAs of White and Black students… engh, kinda not fair. Every major has its hard and easy classes, so you can’t really determine the level of difficulty for every time a GPA is calculated unless you go through each person’s grades for similar difficulty level classes with a fine-toothed comb. The only way to be fair about that is to compare those in same majors or colleges. Eg you can’t compare an Engineering major to a, let’s say, Media Studies major. Although everyone is entitled to recognition for their hard work, whether they are Black and in Media Studies with a 4.0 or White in Engineering with a 4.0. It ain’t easy either way!
Seconded. I majored in psychology, but I invite any major to come take developmental neuroscience or psychopharmacology and then tell me about my easy major.
I agree. I was a Sociology major and I dare anyone to take Social Theory. Hard as hell and boring to boot. We had two take home finals but both had to be between 15 & 20 pages.
You can make numbers say anything. Numbers may make the argument presented, but it is neither a sound experiment nor a strong argument by any means. I am an African American, non immigrant, female, pre-med, engineer, who graduated from an Ivy League University. I saw many of my female engineering peers, who were also pre-med, switch from the engineering degree to a bachelors in applied science to have a less demanding course load. But at what cost, or shall I say what gain?
These Black women chose this option in an effort to get better grades and ultimately be considered more competitive by the graduate programs where they planned to apply. We saw many pre-med’s majoring in french, English, Psych, and touting GPA’s upwards of 3.8 while the average freshman engineering GPA was a 2.8 across all races. I believe that many of the African Americans who switch to an easier subject, may simply be playing the game. Any medical school admission information packet will tell you schools don’t care if you studied astrophysics at Harvard or English at Spelman, you need to have as lcose to a 4.0 science and cumulative GPA as possible. If I had it to do again I’m not so sure I wouldn’t have chosen the better GPA, a lighter courseload, a less stressful undergrad, and saved the 30K (plus interest!) I spent on a post baccalaureate program to be considered a more desirable candidate for medical school. I say Hurrah (Hurrah! Hurrah, for Pennsylvania!) to the Black students at Duke hopefully having some foresight to make sure that they look right on paper, ensuring they can dream of the next step, because getting rid of a bad GPA is like overcoming bad credit; it’s possible, but few recover.
Oh and one more point. All of the girls who switched majors from engineering to applied science, were told to do so by faculty advisers. This was suggested of myself as well, but I refused figuring it to be a conspiracy theory of the faculty to hold me back from my true potential. There are not enough advisers encouraging the more challenging path, but their advice proved to be a double edge sword. Three of us are in medical school, one is getting a PHD in pharmaceuticals, and one has acquired like 5 masters. Perhaps the Blacks who are accepted to top tier schools and choose “softer” majors are just more likely to be academics, where as the white males are less likely to pursue a graduate degree outside of Business, law, or engineering.
There are so many factors at play, without interviewing the actual students, this report took away people’s voices and put words in their mouths….so it it inherently non-factual.
Another study to prove our lesser value. How many does that make now?
While the study and numbers may be true, what does it prove? The study does not deliver any real answers, but lends to support the current trend of regression on race.
People upset with the research study in this article clearly did not major in STEM fields, lol. The study is not racist just because it offends you.
What is particularly troubling about the Duke Professors’ study
http://public.econ.duke.edu/~p…
is that it equates affirmative action with black. The Supreme Court ruled in 2003 (Grutter v. Bollinger) that race based college admissions can be used if ‘narrowly tailored’ and not an ‘overr-idding’ factor in the selection criteria. Thus, it is constitutional to use race as ‘one’ of the ‘many’ factors in an equation that contribute to admissions but it is NOT the only or the overriding (tipping point) factor. Affirmative Action does not = black. In fact, a letter in Duke’s Chronicle by ‘anonymous’ notes that Duke (as the Supreme Court ruled) “does not count race or anything else’ as a sole factor of admissions. Again Grutter v. Bollinger provides the clearest reference for Affirmative Action in college admissions up to now. Why do the Professors make this egregious jump and connect black students switching majors (and just being black) to AA policy? Professors please step away from your research and go back to research basics: (clarify definitions).
This study also uses race to stratify/examine students when, if we read the study itself, the authors show that some black undergraduates at Duke come from private schools (23% which is more than double the national average of 9.5% for blacks in private schools http://www.jbhe.com/vital/60_i… and have either a mother and/or father with an advanced/professional degree (32% at Duke ; National Average is below this number for sure just can’t find it right away http://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/d… ). Maybe there is a narrative this research failed to show that would be more productive and illuminating. What about class?
Additionally, over 70% of the survey respondents (for black students) were women. There are tons of studies (http://scholar.google.com/scho… about women and minority women in the STEM fields. The professors do a horrible job of situating their research into the broader context of research in the field. The professors do a poor job of disaggregating the data and accounting for “differences”. Black students/White students/Asian students are not all alike. The professors do an embarrassing job of trying to assert (mention/hint at) a ‘policy’ recommendation/suggestion/thougt(?). They clearly have no idea what Affirmative Action is or how it operates.
It baffles me (or maybe I really shouldn’t be so shocked) why people (including professors such as the 2 at Duke who authored the study with a grad student) don’t take time out to understand the definition of Affirmative Action and how it is currently ”applied” in the US context.
And…last but not least the Humanities are ‘easier’? I’m just outdone with the elitism and downright disrespect for the academy and liberal arts education. Where are the voices of professors in the Humanities? The so called ‘easier’ subjects/professions.
Thank you Duke Students and Alumni for calling this out. People please read the study. The students have a right to speak out ESPECIALLY because of potential relevance in the pending Fisher v. Univ. of Texas Supreme Court case. (The Court has not decided to review the case yet…)
This is the big deal. Where is the paper trail? How did this document become an amicus brief??
You cite the Grutter case, but you don’t bother bringing up the Gratz and Bakke cases where Affirmative Action was ruled unconstitutional?
Even in the Grutter case, the issue was whether Michigan was using a quota system, and the ultimate ruling was no, but there is strong statistical evidence that says yes.
With Gratz, Michigan was using a point system at the time and 100 points was a guaranteed admit. Minority applicants received a 20-point bonus. A perfect SAT score was only worth 12 points. Michigan was forced to scrap the point system, but there is no reason to believe they didn’t continue using race to evaluate candidates in just as important a fashion as they did before.
In Bakke, UofC-Davis was ordered to admit a then 33 year-old who had applied multiple times and had excellent undergrad GPA and medical school entry scores, was a worked as a NASA engineer, and was an Marine with the rank of Captain. The school had until then operated with a racial quota of approximately 16 students per class reserved for minorities.
Grutter, if anything, was ruled incorrectly because, as I mentioned before, Michigan’s system worked as a quota; and quotas were ruled to be a violation in Bakke, as they should have been.
My own experiences in science and math classes are filled with memories of students and teachers alike making the the assumption that I am incapable of handling the material. Perhaps these numbers are a reflection of the ramifications of this type of racism.
AMEN. As a very cisgendered/girly black female, I’ve had Economics professors at a top national university treat me like I had no chance at grasping the material. It wasn’t the actual material and subject matter that dissuaded me from the department; it was how uncomfortable the people in the department made me feel. I’d be willing to be many minority students have felt the same way.
It think it’s a smart move, to be honest. If both our degrees say Harvard, it doesn’t matter if I take art and you take life sci. The moment I realized I was getting the same degree as everyone else, I began thinking strategically about classes.
I’m a double Ivy and at both my schools there is a tradition of the older black students telling the younger black students about easier classes and good professors. Who wants to struggle if their heart is not in it?
Also, humanities are not easier than science. It takes a different set of skills. I had pre-med friends who struggled with 7 page papers while I was turning in 25 page papers in a week. It wasn’t easy, but I learned the skill.
Sidenote: I hope I’m an affirmative action case. Consider it my reparations. I’m going to take my affirmative action degree to get my affirmative action job and fight to end disparity.
Affirmative action=racism.
“PS. And sometimes all these HBCUs aren’t even the best choices in education. If you wanna be something, go to where you will be given the best education. So what if there aren’t alot or even one other Black person at that place. Be diverse, be open to other cultures. Stop being so stuck in your ways and open your mind to the world, because once you do, so many opportunities will be available to you. SMH”
Dr. Carter G. Woodson’s thesis, The Mis-Education of the Negro, is still in print; let us all read it to determine what implications are still relevant today. There are over 4000 colleges and universities in the U.S., and 105 HBCU’s; why do we still group HBCU’s as if they are a monolith? Why aren’t all predominantly white colleges grouped like this I wonder? Why is it that if a student attends an HBCU, he or she is not embracing diversity because he or she is of the majority population? Why do we not say to white students who attend predominantly white colleges that they are not embracing diversity? Why is ‘predoninantly white’ still the best? Why is it that individuals who have never attended an HBCU always state that HBCU’s are not the best educational choices? It is because, many Black/African Americans still feel that white is right?Do they feel that white is still better? Do they feel that black is less than, and that it could never be euqal to what is white? Mis-educated black folks tell me daily that they would never attend a “black” college, but get up every Sunday morning and attend and drive to a black church! LOL Sometimes it is even a Historically Black church! At other times, they have joined historically black fraternities and sororities, or even black student associations; yet, black colleges are still inferior? I am not directing these statements/questions to you “Mimi”; I do not know you. I am a Ph.D. student (at a white college of course ) and travel across the country presenting on HBCU’s; your statement above just prompted me to respond. I find many of the comments fascinating; however, my expertise concerns HBCU’s which is why I focused on your statement.