Victim Blaming By Any Other Name Is Still Victim Blaming

by Kirsten West Savali

Ironically, one of the most ignorant posts I’ve read in recent weeks appeared on a blog that goes by the name of “Very Smart Brothas.”

In an astoundingly insensitive article, aptly titled Rape Responsibility — And The Fine Line Between Victim-Blaming and Common Sense”, The Champ, a blogger on the site, decided to tackle the subject of rape and why women, in fact, do hold some responsibility for sexual assaults against their person.

He found his inspiration from a post written by writer Zerlina Maxwell for Ebony.com titled, “Stop Telling Women How to Not Get Raped.”

In Maxwell’s article, she brilliantly states why society’s misdirected venom towards “unladylike” women is endangering potential victims:

“Our community, much like society-at-large, needs a paradigm shift as it relates to our sexual assault prevention efforts.  For so long all of our energy has been directed at women, teaching them to be more “ladylike” and to not be “promiscuous” to not drink too much or to not wear a skirt. Newsflash: men don’t decide to become rapists because they spot a woman dressed like a video vixen or because a girl has been sexually assertive.”

Even though The Champ agrees that statistics revealing that 1 in 5 women will become victims of a completed or attempted rape in their lifetime are horrific, he draws the line at agreeing that men, and men alone, are responsible for women being violated, stating that women should employ a modicum of common sense when dealing with their baser male counterparts:

“Why can’t both genders be educated on how to act responsibility around each other? What’s stopping us from steadfastly instilling “No always means no!” in the minds of all men and boys and educating women how not to put themselves in certain situations? Of course men shouldn’t attempt to have sex with a woman who’s too drunk to say no, but what’s wrong with reminding women that if you’re 5’1 and 110 pounds, it’s probably not the best idea to take eight shots of Patron while on the first, second, or thirteenth date? Yes, sober women definitely get raped too, but being sober and aware does decrease the likelihood that harm may come your way, and that’s true for each gender.

“It seems as if the considerable push back again victim-blaming has pushed all the way past prudence and levelheadedness, making anyone who suggests that “women can actually be taught how to behave too” insensitive or a “rape enabler.” And, while the sentiment in Maxwell’s article suggests that victim-blaming is dangerous, I think it’s even more dangerous to neglect to remind young women that, while it’s never their fault if they happen to get sexually assaulted, they shouldn’t thumb their noses to common sense either.”

And this is where the waters get treacherous.

  • sunshyne84

    I don’t see it so much as victim blaming, but a reminder not to put yourself in potentially dangerous situations. Like how I take my trash out in the day time instead of at night. Men shouldn’t rape women, but we can’t tell a rapist from every other man so we have to use common sense and take precautions.

  • http://thedaughterofafrika.blogspot.com/ African Mami

    OHHHHHHHHH MI GOSH!!!!!!! *I STAND IN APPPLLLLLLLAUSEEEEE*** Ms. Savali, this is the one article you’ve written I have amened throughout the post! My God! You speak so articulately. There was victim blaming on Deelish’s story, and the comments on there were super crazy. I and a few other Clutchettes were involved in a back and forth as to why-the VICTIM is not to blame! I also saw the same article you mention on VSB, and I did not comment for I did not know whether to cry or shoot somebody!

    This is what I’m talking about! Thank you for articulating this so well.

  • http://thedaughterofafrika.blogspot.com/ African Mami

    my dear, tell that statement to the many countless women in the Congo-who have been raped, and not because they were in potentially dangerous situations. No, but they still end up being blamed.

    How about that girl like you and me, going about her business in her a skirt and a regular ol blouse-waylaid from home and raped. and still gets blamed

    My point is, victim shaming and blaming is very much part of our society-human ie. I’ve read rape cases in which yahoo commentors have torn the victim into shreds-even when they don’t have the full details. It’s even worse in our community.

    God helps us. Ms.Savali, again I salute your English….coz lawwd knows if you and I were to get into a competition, I would loose, coz I would only write one word. Motherfuggers!

  • Miss September

    I somewhat agree with the previous comment, but on the other hand it is a double edge sword. Just because a woman is alone with a man or even invited him to touch/pleasure her it does not give the excuse for him to rape her. NO MEANS NO ….yes we as women need use more discretion but that does not justify a man taking something that you did consent to give him no matter the circumstance. I think that women need to be more supportive of women who have been victims, to let them know that they did not warrant being taken advantage of .It is strength in numbers. If we rallied more around victims, I think men would practice more self control. They are not animals in a jungle, jeez the way some women excuse this type of behavior is deplorable …smh its really sad…..

  • Miss September

    * previous comment direct to @sunshyne84

  • Socially Maladjusted

    society needs to focus on controlling men, not women.

    Rape is wrong, no excuses, no arguments no if, ands or buts.

    It is a violation of personal autonomy and choice, which as a human being and the Ascedent of Enslaved Africans, I understood all too well, and for those reasons make rape a particularly is abhorrent crime to me.

    If a woman does not want to have sex with you – don’t force her. If she agrees to sex but later and changes her mind, incuding during sex, then stop.

    Now let’s go over some other facts about rape.

    !) The power element in rape is the force applied to execute a rape, the motive however is in most cases – SEX.

    2) removing the sexual motive from rape is way to dehumanixe the rapist as a sadist who derives some twisted pleasure from torturing his victims.

    If we saw the rapist as someone trying to fulfil the basic human need for intimacy, then we might see the rapist in more sympathetic terms.

    That is the reason many men still insist on assigning some blame to the victim. They sympathize to some extent with the rapist. They imagine themselves a heightened state of sexual arousal and imagine that under the same circumstances, they might act with the same lack of control.

    Yes men do rape and most often it is because they’ve lost control of themselves, which means simply telling people to control themselves is not the answer –

    Telling people to control themselves is rarely the answer to impulsive or compulsive – (eg over eating food addicts) – behaviour.

    So how do we solve the problem of rape without completely isolating the sexes from each other?

    I don’t know

    but I know that I would resist any further efforts to control the male population on the pretext of protecting women from rape.

  • QoNew

    @African Mami

    “..tell that statement to the many countless women in the Congo…”

    I agree with sunshyne84. Women shouldnt put themselves in harms way if they can help it. Therefore dont go on holiday in the Congo.

    “How about that girl like you and me, going about her business in her a skirt and a regular ol blouse-waylaid from home and raped. and still gets blamed.”

    Yes because we know that this is the typical rape scenario. Women just going about her business and some man out of no where just rapes her. Girl please.

    “I’ve read rape cases in which yahoo commentors have torn the victim into shreds-even when they don’t have the full details.”

    We do worse to those accused of rape without the full details or a verdict from a jury of his or her own peers.

  • QoNew

    @sunshyne84

    As African Mami alluded to, she thinks she is in as much of a risk of being raped wearing a skirt going about her business at the mall as a woman is in the war torn country of the Democratic Republic of the congo. This is why the message of taking certain precautions falls on deaf ears.

  • CD86

    Some of you are fucked in the head really. I don’t know what else to say.

  • fuchsia

    Unfortunately it’s become socially acceptable to stand idle while a friend or relative takes advantage of someone weaker, whether it be boys or girls doing the intimidating. In that instance a child recognizes their own power in society, before they even know what victim blaming is, and that is a huge problem. Girls who recognize their own social power (“the mean girls”) grow up to raise rapist.

    We as a society need to teach our boy’s that by default they are to be protectors and defenders. If we teach our boys not to be bullies as well as what they should be doing instead, we teach them not to be rapists. When they see a vulnerable woman they should go into protector mode, no matter how she ends up in that vulnerable state. I think it can be changed in one generation if bullying and rape are linked together at an early age.

    I tend to find it interesting that a man’s “vulnerable” state is when he is behind bars. Friends and family rally to support their “vulnerable” men no matter what they did or didn’t do wrong to get in that situation because they recognize the power structure. Yet they fail to grasp the concept that rape is not just a woman’s issue, it’s the product of another power structure that affects everyone.

  • notonfb

    Some time ago there was a rapist in NYC attacking women who walked through the park. The police issued a warning informing women that this rapist targeted scantily dressed women. Instead of women saying thank you for looking out for our best interests, so many were up in arms accusing the authorities of minimalizing the the progress women have made to imprint no means no. The police never BLAMED the women who were raped. Per their job, which is to profile the rapist, they issued a warning of protection. No different then when they issue warnings stating prostitutes are being murdered or those driving high cost SUVs are being car jacked in certain areas.
    Of course no means no. But guess what ladies, all men will not heed to that. Therefore, I’d rather listen to men and follow their words of wisdom. Women take precaution all the time…walking down the street, when out alone, in parking lots, at night, etc. So why not listen to men when they inform us that certain sexual behavior may lead to sexual assaults. These men who rape know that no means no, they just dont give a rats A S S. Im going to protect myself. Will that be a guarantee that I wont get raped… nope. But when I hear stories like a friend of mine (who was raped doing the same thing Deelishis did ) I will think twice and not do the same. For my safety, not for women’s progress.
    And my friend reported it to the police. It went no where b/c she went participated in oral sex. So when the accuser said it was consensual, she no longer had a case. My not be justice, but that is what went down.

  • http://changecomesslow.com/2012/01/19/slut-shaming-and-victim-blaming-the-word-no-part-11/ Nikeshaelise

    Rape is a difficult subject for men to tackle because the experience is often times purely an observation. They don’t live with the fear or awareness women do that when we walk down the street late at night or early in the morning or even in the middle of the afternoon we don’t know that a catcall won’t turn into something more. Asking women to be more accountable is not too much to ask but we as women are not always falling over drunk or tooted up in the club enticing men who can’t control themselves to come and get it.

    Victim blaming is real. Look at the DSK case. Look at the case coming out now against the son of New York’s police commissioner. High profile cases get swept under the rug. Everyday rape cases rarely get media attention and even more cases may not be unreported. rape is real and wrong and men should never get a pass ever no matter what she was wearing how much she drank or if she was cooking dinner in a burqa hijab and niquab.

    The best way to educate and raise awareness on the issue is to have more honest conversations like this one and of course not giving people a pass when they don’t understand that no always means NO!

  • QoNew

    @Socially

    This may be a crude analogy but we are far more careful and mindful or we are socially required to be more mindful of our material possesions than we are with ourselves. We indulge in victim blaming all the time when we arent mindful of our possessions while out; when we carelessly pass on our personal details to potential fraudsters; when we leave our car doors open.

  • QoNew

    @Nikeshalies

    Yes, rape is a difficult subject for men to tackle especially when they are a victim. We mock male victims of rape. We taunt them about how, when they go to prison they will be someone’s b***. We thinks its funny. Quite ironic when these same victims of rape come back into our community with HIV or Hepititus and begin infecting black women.

  • peaches

    Ladies, when you go out on the first date, you may meet the guy at the restaurant instead of having him pick you up at your home. Why?

    Let’s not confuse no means no with taking precaution. Let’s not confuse blaming the victim with encouraging women to place their safety at the forefront.

    And do I do wish men like Very Smart Brothas will use their voice to speak to their male counterparts about protecting society and not using their physical power to harm us.

  • peaches

    You are accusing SUNSHYNE84 of, “Excus(ing) this type of behavior…),” when she did no such thing.

    Basically your comment is similar to hers. SUNSHYNE84 stated that, “(This is a)reminder not to put yourself in potentially dangerous situations.” She also stated, “Men shouldn’t rape women, but we can’t tell a rapist from every other man so we have to use common sense and take precautions,”

    You sated the same thing, “Yes we as women need use more discretion but that does not justify a man taking something that you did consent to give him no matter the circumstance.”

    What is the difference between your statement and SUNSHYNE84?

  • peaches

    @ Socially

    I get what you are saying. I think we have to speak to both men and women to get a better understading of how we can eliminate rape (or shall I say reduce rape). I think date rape is the most common. And being a woman I know that most of us do take precaution when out with men. So clearly this precaution doesnt prevent rape. Im sure the rape numbers are MUCH MORE higher than what’s reported because often women blame themselves and dont report it.
    As a woman I know it’s my right to say no at any time during sex. I have used that right and have been successful each and every time. Men have respected my wishes in the mist of extreme sexual arousal and I am so greatful that they did not use this power that you mentioned to rape me. But I dont think I will continue do certain sexual actions simple because I have heard too many stories of rape victims. Therefore, I’d rather use their experiences in an effort to prevent rape happening to me.

  • bob

    Yo people take shit that does not belong to them. People steal when they are deprived of something or want something they can not have. That is life and human nature you will not change it. you have to use your common sense in situations if you walk through a group of horny drunk guys naked , you are probably going to get your ass grabbed. If I went to a prison and walked through the showers bending over to get some soap, without protection some dude is probably going to stick his penis up my behind. This what some people do they take what does not belong to them, the act is disgusting and it is wrong but their are alot of crimes that are wrong but people still commit them. you can protect yourself from these bad people by using common sense. or you can think that you are living in a paradise where nobody will rape you and if they do its just their fault. Women are not dumb take responsibility for your actions if you did something stupid to put yourself in the situation to be raped you have some responsibility in not protecting yourself. if I left the keys in my benz with the door open and the car still running in front of the projects , and when I came back it was gone, the person who stole it was wrong, but I must admit what I did was very stupid.

  • Tonton Michel

    The problem I have with this victim blaming and accountability argument is that both sides take it to extremes. No one deserves to be raped regardless of the circumstances. But telling women to take precautions is not victim blaming. Saying rape victims provoked the rape from men is as ridiculous as running around acting like all men know better or care to know better. There are criminals walking among men and to pretend otherwise is putting your self at risk.

  • baabaa

    As I woman, I agree. There is a difference between blaming and taking precaution.

  • Mimi

    Am I the only one who finds “The Chump’s” (no typo, I meant CHUMP) article totally repulsive??? For him to say that a 5’1″ 110 pound woman should take several shots of patron while out with a guy is basically giving the guy permission to think “well she’s drunk so I’m just gonna take it even if she says no”. This article has made me so incredibly mad that I can’t even type right. I don’t care if I’m walking down the street butt naked with a bottle of patron in one hand and a joint in the other. THAT STILL DOES NOT GIVE ANYONE THE RIGHT TO TOUCH ME!!!!!!! When will we ever get over the victim blaming??? No woman asks to be raped. No situation makes it “understandable” why a woman got raped. I don’t care how she’s dressed, how much she had to drink or how she looks. And anyone who uses these reasons as to why they raped someone should be prosecuted to the fullest extent. And anyone who thinks these reasons are acceptable to take what they want is just pure scum.

  • JaeBee

    “a reminder not to put yourself in potentially dangerous situations. Like how I take my trash out in the day time instead of at night.”

    The problem is, we focus too much of our time trying to control the behavior of innocent women (even if it is a safety precaution) then we do controlling the behavior of rapist men. Does anyone else not see the gender imbalance?

    I find it abominably that as a woman, you should be afraid to take the trash out at night instead of during the day because of potential violence that may be enacted upon you. I doubt there are very many men that would have the same fear (even those who could “easily” be assaulted because they are not not very big or muscular). The problem is in the way we as a society handle violence against women. It doesn’t help that the justice system is not very “understanding” of the plight of the victim and often engages in such victim blaming tactics as you used above (“Well, why were you out in the middle of the night? Why were you wearing such a short skirt? Why did you allow the guy to perform oral sex on you if you weren’t interested in intercourse?”) that it makes it difficult for victims to come forward out of fear of being maligned or knowledge that nothing will be done to punish the rapist.

    It would be great if we had better laws that were more supportive of women who are victims of violence. There needs to be more stringent punishments placed upon perpetrators to make it less easy for them to get away with the crimes that they commit, and which enacted harsher penalties for committing crimes. Maybe if more men who rape are taken off the streets, it will make it safer for women to be able to take out the trash at night without fear of being harmed.

  • LemonNLime

    This entire scenario makes me hella mad. Why is everyone always telling women to have “common sense” and not drink or wear short clothing? Where are the people telling me the have “common sense” and don’t effing rape people?!? I just cannot comprehend how people equate my clothing or what I’m drinking or where I am walking to being the things that trigger a man to rape as if he is not responsible for his actions. Since when have rapist become mindless amebas that don’t have freewill and I mind of their own?

    My God does this rational trickle down to the youngest of victims? What do you tell those boys who were harassed and raped by that coach? “Well if you hadn’t been so innocent” or “well you should have known not to be alone with him”. Does it trickle down to the most conservatively dressed victims? Guess what, there are plenty of women raped in countries where they are covered in sheets and can’t leave their house. Are they to blame partially too? COME ON! These monsters are responsible for their OWN actions! If I rob and kill someone who was at the ATM at night, are we going to blame the person who was killed because he should have had “common sense” or are we going to blame the thief and murder? How are rape and and the situation I described any different?

    I can’t handle this.

  • JaeBee

    “Telling people to control themselves is rarely the answer to impulsive or compulsive – (eg over eating food addicts) – behaviour.

    So how do we solve the problem of rape without completely isolating the sexes from each other?

    I don’t know but I know that I would resist any further efforts to control the male population on the pretext of protecting women from rape.”

    This is ridiculous. Why shouldn’t we have these expectations? We expect people to control themselves and not steal something that they may want and desire–even though human nature would have us take the object to gratify ourselves and for our own benefit. If you can’t control yourself, then you don’t deserve to be an active member of society. You should either be behind bars, or in the case of rapists we can castrate you and maybe that will help your “control” issues.

  • apple

    these comments got be one of the most unempathetic and soulless comments i have ever read . You people wanna go on with the woman should know this that blah blah etc but the moment you get raped, your daughter,your mom,sister,cousin, and even son gets rape you wanna b*tch and moan and cry all on tv, and everyone around you on how it shouldn’t have happen. i don’t care if you walking in booty shorts at the crack of dawn. its not okay to RAPE YOU ..ITS NOT .. .there is no JUSTIFICATION in why THATS OKAY!!! i don’t care what scenario you use its just not okay to rape someone!

    now all you people saying women be cautious and stuff..you think just because you cautious it can’t happen to you? do you think your so invincible that you can stop a rape at anytime or not see it coming at all times? where i live, lately let me tell you the many scenarios of the mass raping thats been going on it.

    -female students walking to elementary/high school to their usual route being jumped and raped.
    -college students walking home together from a game thinking their being cautious by being together and being raped.
    -women calling for a cab and being RAPED BY THE CAB DRIVER.. guess they didn’t see that coming
    **and guess what most of these was in BROAD DAY LIGHT. no shady corners or bad places.. near their f*king bus stops,churches and schools!

    so what did they deserve to be raped? was that school uniform enticing you so much?

    STOP WITH THIS SH*T and put yourself in a rape victim shoes…do you deserve to be raped? does your love ones deserved to be raped? DOES ANYONE DESERVE TO BE RAPED? if ever in your head you think yes…you have no soul

  • JaeBee

    You’re right…telling a woman to take precautions is NOT victim blaming. Questioning a woman on why she didn’t take precautions; is however! Asking a woman why she “put herself in a position” where she could be raped IS victim blaming.

  • JaeBee

    I meant to write “abominable”, not “abominably”.

  • M12Casey

    I don’t have that much of a problem with what The Champ said because I don’t see it as victim blaming. No does mean no and a men has no right to rape a woman no matter how she is dressed or how she acts or whether she is drunk or not. However, there is no harm in teaching young women how to lessen the risk of being attacked by not walking at night alone, keeping their eye on their drink, not going to a strange man’s house etc. These are just precautions that women should take.

    It’s a really thin line because there are some situations where a victim might (MIGHT because we all know that if a man wants to rape a woman he can do it no matter what the situation is) have been able to avoid being raped if she wasn’t at that particular place at that particular time doing whatever she was doing, but the man still has no right to take advantage of her even if he can.

  • baabaa

    @JaeBee

    Harsher punishment doesnt prevent crime.Honestly, I dont believe stronger punishment will relieve our sense of safety. Because we are overwhelmingly physically inferior men will attack us. Yes, we need to speak to our young men regarding their part in keeping s safe and not growing up to be perpetrator. (I wonder how many parents actually make this an essential lesson when training their boys????). But in the mean time, I will take precaution at all times. Including during intimate occassions.

  • baabaa

    If you’re walking down the street butt naked with a bottle of patron in your hand OF COURSE it DOES NOT give a guy the right to rape you. But believe it or not you are setting yourself up for rape. You have to live in the real world. I can guarantee that you will not do such a thing to avoid being rape. Most men will not rape you but it only takes one to snatch you and do so. Now if you are walking down the street with 3 layers of clothes on will that prevent you from being raped? No. But I know you know the difference between being butt naked and heavily clothed.

  • baabaa

    Those who are upset and up in arms are accusing The Champ of justifying a rapist’s action and he is doing no such thing. These commentors who are refusing to separate precaution from blaming the victim, I can guarantee, take precaution when they are out with men or out alone.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    jaebee

    Yeh, you’re right but despite the fact that there are lots of things we shouldn’t do, and are told not to do -

    ALL OF US still do them.

    Unfortunately, some of those things have serious consequences.

    Getting angry at me won’t cure the world’s problems.

    I suggest you start thinking about how you can HUMANELY address the issues that are important to you without becoming a fascist who wants to control people -

    rather than solve problems.

  • baabaa

    Did The Champ say that women deserved to be raped or that rape was justified because of women were walking home alone or wore skimpy attire? No, he said no such thing. Neither did any of the commentors. He stated that their was no justification for rape. So why are you suggesting that anyone is blaming the victim and excusing the rapist? You are confusing giving advice with taking away our power as women.

    When you get in your car do you lock your door? Why? You lock your door to avoid being snatched, robbed, etc. Is this a guarantee you wont be harmed? No. But you do it as a precaution. If you dont look your car are you giving permission for a criminal to take your car? No. You do this as a precaution. You were taught to do so by your parents, by police suggestion, etc. So why are you getting upset when people suggest women take precaution to avoid rape? No one is saying that it will guarantee rape will not happen, but like locking your door, it makes it less probable.

  • Tonton Michel

    No one is talking about questioning a woman why she didn’t take precautions after a rape. What is being said here is that there should be precautions taken to lessen the risk of being raped.

  • LMO85

    To baabaa and all of the other extremely DENSE commentariat–

    The author of this post and the one that triggered that fool’s response DO NOT SUGGEST THAT WOMEN SHOULD NOT TAKE PRECAUTIONS. THAT IS NOT THE POINT. OF COURSE in everyday situations most normal folks take precautions. Guess what? That doesn’t mean accidents don’t happen, that doesn’t mean you won’t become a victim of a crime. However, do we blame the person who was hit by the drunk driver, or the drunk driver who had no control over themselves or their vehicle when he/she hits and kills someone? THE POINT IS the onus is on MEN to take responsibility and accountability for THEIR OWN actions and that should be the education, that should be what is emphasized, shouted from the rooftops and relayed over and over again. Society needs to re-direct this conversation. BOYS from baby up need to be taught self respect, honor and discipline. Perhaps if we didn’t live in a rape culture that still portrays women as objects instead of human beings with their own agency–then some of you would get a muthafuckkin clue. In this life, you can only CONTROL YOURSELF. It doesn’t matter what else happens to you, in front of you, with you or around you–YOU make the decision to act or not act. If we know this in every other situation, why is this any different? Why must women be told this countless times–that they need to take precautions but men are not told countless times that unless they hear an enthusiastic YES, and that if they DO hear an emphatic NO–that they need to control themselves and walk away? The point is men should be told this over and over and over until it reaches through to the the thickest white meat (as Bernie Mac would say-RIP). WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND? Jesus, Mary and Joseph.

  • Angie

    This ia actually in agreement with QoNew…you are right. We are so vigilant in protecting our cars, bank accounts, homes, passwords, social security numbers, and other material possessions from thieves and robbers and in doing so, we are not considered victims, nor are we letting the thieves and robbers off the hook, we are simply being cautious. Why are people so resistant to the same message of self protection when it comes to the awful topic of rape? Yes, a woman should be able to take the trash out at night or wear whatever she wants to wear and not feel like she could be attacked just as much as I should be able to leave my door unlocked at home or let my little boy play outside without me watching him like a hungry momma bear but sadly, that is not the world we live in. The message that I get is simply just BE CAREFUL. I cannot control a rapist’s actions no more than I can control a thief or a drug dealer or any other criminal. All I can do is be CAREFUL. It’s just that simple.

  • JaeBee

    “Harsher punishment doesnt prevent crime.Honestly, I dont believe stronger punishment will relieve our sense of safety.”

    Harsher punishment may not eliminate crime, but it will help to prevent it. If all rapists received life sentences in jail then there would be less rapists on the streets to re-offend. If all rapists were forcibly castrated, then they’d have less “motivation” to engage in such an activity again..

    If we as a society took a harsher stance against men who commit violent acts towards women it wouldn’t make it so easy for men to get away with, and to continue to re-offend. That may influence others to think twice before they commit a first offense.

  • sli

    We all know that no one deserves to be raped no matter what they have on or how much they’ve had to drink or what time of night they’re walking on the street? Rape and victim blaming is a huge problem in this world, and I don’t think that anyone is saying that it’s not. But come on ladies, taking precautions against crime, any crime is just a part of life. It’s a part of life because we do not live in a perfect society. To reiterate what some others have said, when we’re at home, we lock our doors and windows and turn on the alarm. When going to the mall or work or church, we lock our cars. When in the grocery, we make sure we don’t wander off and leave our purses in the shopping kart. So how is it that we can use common sense and take precautions with our homes, cars, and purses, but not our bodies? Why is that so difficult to understand?

    Yes, no means no. Some men get that and understand. Some don’t get it and have to be taught; it has to be drilled into their heads over and over again—preferably starting at a young age. And some men don’t care; those are the ones we need to be concerned about. I don’t know what man understands what, so I’m looking at every man as a potential rapist. We are taught to drive defensively because there are some fools on the road. So being aware of our surroundings and not putting ourselves into questionable situations helps to protect us from the fools in this world. We have to always, always be aware of our surroundings. And sadly, no matter how many precautions we take, we still may become a victim. But to take none and not utilize our God given intuition because we think that every man should be an honorable and upstanding gentleman is simply foolish. We can’t naively believe that every person knows right from wrong. If that were the case, the jails wouldn’t be full.

  • QONewcastle

    @Jae Bee

    And perhaps if we cut off the hands of those who stole we would be living in a society where theft was non existent. Where is your date proving anything you are saying? I was sexually assaulted as a child by someone I assume was no older than 18. What would have prevent him from assaulting me if he had never assaulted before or he was never accused, and found guilty of a sexual act? Ultimately it is up to the woman to behave in anyway she deems fit but certain behaviors come with their risk. That is with everything in life. Stop being so childish. You are potentially putting people at risk by telling them there is nothing they can do to prevent crimes from happening to them.

    As an experiment, why not leave your doors and windows open in your home or in your car. Society shouldnt control you by telling you to lock your car do or close your windows because of potential intruders. I bet you wouldnt dream of taking those risk would you?

    “We expect people to control themselves and not steal something that they may want and desire–even though human nature would have us take the object to gratify ourselves and for our own benefit. ”

    How well has that worked out?

    How do you control the behavior of people who would rape if they have never raped before? What you want to do is control the behavior of ALL men so as to prevent any rapes. How about we just lock all men up after they turn 14 years old ensuring no woman or girl is in harms way. We can put them in concentration camps.

    Our society doesnt tell me to rape. Quite the contrary. Men, all men, are told that they are potential violent brutes that need to be controlled. I dont want to live in that society.

  • JaeBee

    “Getting angry at me won’t cure the world’s problems.”

    First of all, I am not angry with you and don’t see how my post could be interpreted as such. Responding in disagreement to something you said does not mean I am “angry”.

    “HUMANELY address the issues that are important to you without becoming a fascist who wants to control people -”

    Once again, I don’t see where my post contained evidence of inhumanity, but I guess that term is very subjective. I suggested that rapists should either be put in jail, or castrated if they felt they could not control themselves. Everyone else is expected to control themselves to maintain a civilized society—if you (meaning rapists in general) feel that you can’t do that then you don’t deserve to be in society or should consider other, more effective ways of treating your disorder.

    As for your comment about being a fascist who wants to control people…girl, take a seat! You sound like one of those crazy tea bag republicans who likes to throw around political terms that they know nothing about!

  • baabaa

    I would love to see life sentences for rapists and child molesters. I agree with you on that one. I read somewhere that the average rapist only does 4 1/2 years and are likely to reoffend.

  • Renee

    @QOnew

    your comment was ignorant. the “oh like that’s the typical rape scenario”

    there is no typical rape scenario, which is why rape is so scary.

  • JaeBee

    Hence the reason why I said “you’re right…” . It is not victim blaming to tell a woman to take precautions. Unfortunately, what so often happens, is that when a woman gets raped people look for any evidence to prove that she didn’t take the proper precaution and THAT is when the situation becomes about victim blaming.

    The whole issue of whether women should need to take more precaution in situations where men don’t speaks more to the gender imbalance in our society than it does to anything related to victim blaming.

  • JaeBee

    @Renee

    Most people choose to ignore Queen of Newcastle. As you can see evidence why…

  • The Taker (yeah I rep them GIANTS)

    They not hearing you apple. They still focusing on us women and not the actual PERPETRATORS. Women are bombarded every single freaking day from the time we are born to take precaution here, be careful going here, no you cant do that,no cant do this, don’t wear that, don’t wear this, don’t drink too much of that, do this, do that, always be aware of this, always be aware of that, and so and so on.

    All the extreme measures and precautions we have to take to protect OUR BODIES. Not once have I read anywhere the extreme measures on how you shouldn’t rape someone and how raping is horrible. Have you because I haven’t. The problem with Champ’s article was he talked to us women like we already don’t f*cking know all the crap that is put out there on how to not get rape. But see with all that information and education, 1 in 5 will still get raped, as matter of fact there is probably a slew of rapes and sexual assaults going on right now, most likely by somebody they know and trusted. And bet, they will be blamed for it because you know they didn’t take “precaution”. His article was cold and condescending and that’s what started the backlash.

    What pisses me off is we women know the rules and guidelines on how to “prevent” getting raped. But where the f*ck is the rules and guidelines on how to stop oneself from f*cking raping someone. Where the hell is that? Because I rarely see it. All these dimwits on here keep hollering about women needing to take precaution like we don’t do that daily. GTFOH. How about hollering to inhumane perps to stop raping folks.

  • baabaa

    Too bad you cant have a proper exchange without using insults. So after your first sentence I went blind. Using tact will get you further. My former debate instructor always said that when people resort to insults they either lack the skills to properly express their opinions or lack a plausible point of view.

    Good luck to you. God bless.

  • baabaa

    That’s right. Im focusing on me; the woman

  • LMO85

    Baabaa don’t boohoo because I called you out. It is what it is, GET A CLUE.

    @ The Taker—PREACH.

  • Mimi

    @baabaa My point was, I don’t care if I’m stumbling down drunk. I don’t care if I’m wearing a skirt short enough to expose my underwear. I don’t care if I’m wearing a sweater revealing my cleavage. I don’t care if I’m wearing a winter coat down to my ankles. Whatever I’m wearing or not wearing does not give anyone the right to rape me. I hate it when people try to blame the victim or claim that she had it coming because she “didn’t use common sense” or because of what she was wearing. What ever happened to someone telling everyone that raping people is wrong under any circumstance?

  • iQgraphics

    How about this: Rapist should be shot in the face. Period, thee end.
    Now, lets see how many cats wanna stick it where it’s not wanted.

  • iQgraphics

    if you aint deaf and I say no, that’s it.
    you can’t control your d!ck, I can’t control my itchy trigger finger.

  • baabaa

    Mimi, The Champ and commentors did say that raping women is wrong. Also The Champ mentioned that men need continued education regarding rape prevention on their part. I think that your comment suggests that we are giving rapists a pass. Or that we are negating the man’s sole responsibility in a rape crime. This isnt a Middle Eastern country, we arent blaming women.
    I actually think it’s smart to advise women about how certain situations will give men an excuses to assault women. “Dont leave your drink unattended when you are at a bar.” Why are we told this? B/c something can be slipped into our drink. Now when someone gives me this advice (thanks mom), amI going to get upset and say how dare they accuse the possbible victim? No, Im going to follow that advice to avoid being a possible victim.

  • OohLaLa

    You all are so defensive about the issue that you’re completely ignoring the other side of the argument.

    Rape is wrong.
    So one is saying it’s right or okay.
    No one is saying that what you wear gives someone else the right.
    No one is saying that how drunk you may be gives someone the right.
    No one is saying that the situations/places in which you find yourself gives the right.
    No one is saying that victims are the blame.

    All that is being said to potential victims is why would you make it easier for a rapists who has his mind set on raping.

    People keep trying to give examples and then say, “So there’s something this person could have done to prevent this?” NO. Sometimes there isn’t. There’s hardly much a child can do. There’s hardly much you can do with a gun to your head or even facing just the mere strength of a man. The point is, if there is any one thing you can do to increase the risk just a little bit on any given day (i.e. not traveling alone), why wouldn’t you?

    It is absolutely awful that, as a woman, you have to even think about these things. The reality of the situation is that it needs to be ever-present thoughts in our minds. The fact is that they are out there and they are going to do what they want to do. So I have and will continue to TRY not to place myself in predicament. If it happens anyway, I’m not wrong. If I DON’T do all of these things and it happens, I’m still not wrong.

    I realize my response may be attacked. I just want to say that under no circumstances should a victim be blamed for it happening. This is completely the responsibility of the rapist. Furthermore, I do believe that men should be the ones primarily receiving education about this matter. I just say this, not to place the responsibility on the victim, but to say to women to be conscious of the fact that it does happen and to anything you can to LOWER YOUR RISK if at all possible.

  • Just Me

    I think there’s a distinction to be made between looking out for your own personal safety and victim blaming. I am careful about my safety and would teach my daughter the same thing. Telling my daughter “Don’t catch a ride from a strange man because there are a lot of monsters out there” isn’t the same as saying “If you catch a ride with a strange man you deserve what happens to you.” It’s a subtle difference, but has a huge impact on the amount of blame assigned to rape survivors and perpetrators.

    I think victim blaming happens very often with statements like:

    -”Why were you at his house so late if you weren’t trying to have sex?”
    -”What were you wearing?”
    -”Surely you must have said something to lead him on.”
    -”She’s a slut anyway. She probably wanted it.”
    -”She didn’t fight hard enough/scream loud enough/run away so she must have wanted it.”
    -”She shouldn’t have been walking home alone at night in the first place.”

    …and I’m sure I could think of many more. Statements like this make it seem like men are some kind of wild animal that can’t control itself and shouldn’t be expected to.

    Of course there are rapists out there, so we women need to remain vigilant about our personal safety. We have to make judgement calls about when it’s safe to take public transportation, walk alone, invite a man into our house, get in a man’s car, etc. But just because a woman makes an error in judgement and lets her guard down for one moment around the wrong man at the wrong time doesn’t mean it’s her fault for not protecting herself.

    We need to stop looking so hard for ways to put the blame on the victim. All it does is prevent women from reporting their rapes and allows rapists to go free.

  • http://gisforgrace.wordpress.com NinaG

    and even deaf folks can understand body language

  • DianeV.

    Agreed.

    There’s a difference between, “She shouldnt have benn out that time of night,” than, “Be sure you dont get into the car with unknown men.”

  • isaidiwasntcommentingthisyr

    http://gizmodo.com/5569537/condoms-with-teeth-fight-rape-in-south-africa

    maybe government should issue antirape condom to all female born children and continue sending lifetime supply to protect the vajayjay and female soul from those animals who enjoy taking sex

    i was raped in the middle of my sleep in my own home by my own spouse, multiple xs
    guess i looked really sexy and was in the wrong place at the wrong time with a man i didn’t really know

    i should start walking around with razor blades in my p ussy since i am a walking rape magnet. i mean hell, i already have an alarm system, a glock, brass knuckles, mace & damn whistle (oh yeah, and don’t tell the popo b/c half that shit ain’t legal for carry)

  • http://imsuchanafroholic.blogspot.com SuchAnAfroholic

    I really and truly don’t understand what was so terrible about The Champ’s post. I’m a huge fan of VSB and have lost no love for them due to this “scandal.” As I understand it, he was never trying to say that women who get themselves into less-than-safe situations deserve to be taken advantage of. THAT is victim-blaming, and I didn’t see any of it in his post. All I saw was the same advice my momma gives me whenever I’m going out: be smart, and be careful. We obviously need to switch from being a culture that teaches “don’t get raped” to being a culture that teaches “don’t rape,” but I don’t think that promoting safety amongst women is necessarily antithetical to that endeavor, ESPECIALLY when we non-forcible rape into consideration. By that I mean, like, A and B meet at a bar, get drunk, go home together, and shit goes down without enthusiastic consent and neither A or B know what to think about the situation in the morning. I think that suggesting that the entire onus of responsibility for that situation falls onto the responsibility of the man (if we assume this is a heterosexual encounter) is JUST as dangerous as the female-blaming society we’re trying to grow out of. I think that the most productive step our society could take towards rape prevention and overall healthy sexual living would be to promote responsible sexual conduct for people of all genders: that means more than just drilling into people’s heads that “No means no,” but rather introducing more nuanced understandings of consent, and the ability of persons in various conditions to give consent. If, for example, due to excessive amounts of alcohol consumption, neither party remembers what happened after a night of sexual activity in which enthusiastic consent wasn’t given (because enthusiastic consent can’t really be given if you’re blacked out), why is one party any more responsible for the night’s events than the other? OBVIOUSLY when one party forces him/herself onto another party, the victim bears zero responsibility for the situation, but there’s a lot of grey area between forcible rape and consensual sex. I think it’s perfectly healthy to suggest that, if it takes two informed persons to have consensual sex, all persons should assume at least a little bit of responsibility for making sure they can make informed decisions regarding sex.

  • Cantarah

    I get incredibly frustrated listening to people (usually men) try to justify why they are in the right to partially blame women for their rapes because in some aspect of it they might have failed to demonstrate sufficient common sense. Mainly because that puts women in the position of never ever being able to make any mistake without bearing “partial responsibility” in their eyes for something only the rapist had the power to prevent.

    Most women hear from their mothers from a very early age all the things they need to say and do and be in order to not be victimized and most women seem to internalize them and do their best to remember and follow all of those strictures even when it is incredibly difficult, even when they are young and silly and dumb and don’t always think things through.

    But there are still so many mistakes a woman can make that would make her in the eyes of men like “the Champ”, partially responsible for her own rape and that I can’t accept.

    You want to attract a man? Be sexy and appealing but not too sexy – make sure your outfit isn’t too tight or low or high and don’t wear too high of heels or you won’t be able to outrun an attacker! Flirt but keep in mind at all times that you don’t flirt TOO much or he might interpret it as you “leading him on”. Be open and honest about your life but don’t let him know TOO much about you or he might be able to find out where you live on the Internet and rape you. Be careful not to leave your drink alone so he can’t slip something in it even if there is an emergency or you’re trying to relax from a hard day and have a good time. Be vigilant! But not distrusting or suspicious – dudes hate that. Always know exactly how much you can drink without being too tipsy. Keep in mind that screwing up and drinking too much because you had a horrible day, are at a celebration, are surrounded by people you believe you can trust, or just plain overestimated how much you ate or how much liquor you can hold is a screw up that entitles men like the Champ to assign partial responsibility for your rape to you. Remember to always be in at a decent hour…hopefully you have access to reliable transportation 24 hours a day, right? And if you HAVE to be out at night, make sure you always have two or three backup plans so you are never alone. A nearby and trustworthy friend to call (one that you know won’t rape you!), the cash to hire a cab, etc. But not too much cash. That might be an invitation to get raped AND robbed. Always lock your windows and your door and a backup security plan would be smart – what kind of dumb, broke bitch just has simple latches on her windows that any rapist can smash and break? Jeez. Talk about an invitation to be raped. Also, remember to keep in mind at every point in your life that if you do get raped your entire history, sex life, work life, what you have worn and said, is all fair game to a defense attorney so for the love of God live like a nun. Oh and when you end up getting raped (like most rape victims are) by someone you know and trust…well, shouldn’t you feel like an idiot for trusting him? Just because he’s your brother in law, your uncle, your boss, your childhood friend? You’re supposed to be a sweet, charming, relaxed, friendly, smiling, optimistic, suspicious bitch that never forgets at any point in time that any man be a rapist.

    Men like the Champ will never have to think like any of the above unless he gets sent to prison. Whereas their wives start teaching their daughters to think of all of it at about the age of 12.

  • Miss September

    @ Peaches , First of all I wasn’t addressing you but since referenced what I said to SUNSHYNE84 .I stated that it is a shame how some women excuse this type of behavior (I am paraphrasing here) that comment was not inclusive to SUNSHYNE84 .
    The reason I commented again was because at the time when I was writing my comment she was the previous commenter . Now when I posted it , African Mami had already posted , therefore she was the previous poster .
    Please don’t try to put words in my mouth sweetie . I agree with what she said about women using better judgement , that is all . IT STILL DOES NOT JUSTIFY RAPE !!!
    Ok , who want next ??????

  • iQgraphics

    @NinaG
    SERIOUSLY!!

  • iQgraphics

    @isaid
    That mofo clearly had entitlement issues so I would have entitled his face to a hot pot of grits.

    My word, yall can quote me on this cuz the next muthafcuker to come at me sideways is getting his heart carved from his chest with a spoon.

    And it don’t matter if Im butt bald naked walking down front street pissy as$ drunk.

  • iQgraphics

    Champ is saying naivete on the victims part is a get out of jail free card on the aggressors part.

    GTFOHWTBS

    Wait. I’ll spell that one out.

    Get The Fcuk Outta Here With The BullSh!t

    Wonder if he felt this way if it was his daughter who cut school to chill at a boys house and she got gang raped.

  • apple

    @baabaa poor you, such a sad person

    @The Taker -thank you, i thought maybe i had missed the point or something or was over reacting but seeing baabaa un-empathetic but mostly just pathetic comments i see i was moving in the right direction

  • http://guulo.wordpress.com/ Guulo

    Most rape victims know their attackers so it has little to do with skimpy clothing and putting oneself in a scary situation.

  • E.M.S.

    You can teach all the personal safety tips you want, men are still responsible for raping women. In the end, it is the man who makes the conscious decision to do it. And for me that breaks down into a moral issue.

    You lack respect for someone else’s body if you think, under any circumstances, it is acceptable to rape them.

  • Concerned

    I appreciate that the author is arguing against the idea that a woman revealing her body will increase her likelihood of being on the receiving end of sexual violence. However, I’m concerned that the statement the author makes about the status of women in the middle east might be Islamophobic and inaccurate. Women there are not the ‘most subjugated and cloaked’ – women all over the world suffer because of sexism. Perhaps cultural difference allows us to notice sexism more readily in other people’s cultures. It is of course true that women in the middle east ALSO ‘face the most horrid and violent atrocities’ as do women in Australia, Indonesia, Nigeria or anywhere else in the world.
    When the author says, “alpha-male domination disguised as religion and culture…” I really hope that she doesn’t mean Islam in its entirety, because clearly Islam is much more than “alpha-male domination” and it is a real and rich and highly diverse religion that has links with many different cultures. I think it might be good for the paragraph in question to be reworded, as I’m sure this was not the meaning the author intended to convey.

  • Chocolate_cyn

    Well the solution is clear: Lock up the cookie jar like you do your house, car and other things you buy. /sarcasm/ I know my body belongs to me, but all these comparisons of “you lock your car to be cautious, so be cautious with your body” are just disturbing. I mean I promise if I could remove my goodies and lock them up with the push of a button or turn of the key and then go dancing I WOULD. This take precaution, use common sense thing isn’t victim blaming, but I think it leads to victims feeling shamed enough were once it has happened to them they don’t report it. I mean if u left your car running in the middle of the night unlocked and it was stolen. I am guessing you would still call the police and report it, right? Plus cars, cd players and tv’s are items that are physically no longer there so it’s theft. Rape has more of an assault feel to me. And I am pretty sure since 1 in 5 women are raped that means at least 1 in 12 men are rapists. Just kidding!!! No one in this society cares about the stats of how many men are rapists and if they do they certainly don’t advertise it like they do the stats of how many are rape victims. Now I honestly and truly want some because my homegirl is having a party and these comments have me worried that I may not go out after dark because I need to be cautious and lock it up like my car

  • leonard smalls

    A whore’s uniform makes you a de facto whore; hence, the resultant treatment. Unfortunately, a great deal of our women lack the ability to carry themselves with style and grace, which may beg for the need of such a “behavior modifier.” Sounds harsh, but such “modifiers” may have a place in our community to enforce that fact that their are no individuals (contrary to what society says) and the community is in desperate need of women with style and grace.

    Carry on.

  • Ravi

    the author never addressed what was so wrong about Champ’s post. his words do not even slightly suggest victim blaming. He never says that women that put themselves in the position they are in, deserve what they get. I will definitely teach my nieces not to get drunk with some guy and to take measures to reduce the chances of getting raped, robbed, kidnapped, and murdered. Following the logic of the author, I wouldn’t advise anyone to lock their doors, learn self defense, not walk around campus alone at night, or not hitch rides with strangers in cars with bumper stickers that read “no means yes.” Telling someone that they can reduce the likelihood of being raped is empowering; focusing only on the predators just isn’t very effective.

  • Karmen

    +1

  • oneshot

    Dont forget we are also in need of men with stature and strength. Im sick of seeing black men dressed like thugs with their pants hanging down. This statement goes both ways

  • Tonton Michel

    “Unfortunately, what so often happens, is that when a woman gets raped people look for any evidence to prove that she didn’t take the proper precaution and THAT is when the situation becomes about victim blaming.”

    I see that, OK.

    “The whole issue of whether women should need to take more precaution in situations where men don’t speaks more to the gender imbalance in our society than it does to anything related to victim blaming.”

    I dont see this at all, your inserting gender politics into crime prevention. Rapists do not take these politics into account when they are committing there crime.

  • Candi83

    “if you aint deaf and I say no, that’s it.
    you can’t control your d!ck, I can’t control my itchy trigger finger.”

    +1

  • Socially Maladjusted

    If women want to help stop rape they can start by changing the way they treat sex – stop using sex as medium of exchange, ie something that a woman sells to the highest bidder she can attract.

    It’s one thing (mostly – a bad thing) to create an artificial consumer appetite for your junk goods, but when you commodify human NEEDS, eg – the need for intimacy, so that love and sex are reduced to mere services that people provide for money then you’re asking for trouble.

    It’s very easy to understand once you’ve connected the dots.

    Sex, like everything else, becomes something you can only have in exchange for something, usually money.

    If you already have a social context where gender roles dictate male largesse to females then it’s not a huge leap from that to turn sex into some that men buy and women sell.

    It really shouldn’t be any surprise then that certain attitudes will arise in such a context. Maybe a sense of entitlement to sex if you’ve paid good money for a date.

    The flip side of that may be a sense of disentitlement and exclusion if you don’t have anything to exchange for sex – eg money, status, looks, popularity, youth etc . .

    which leads to the dysfunctional behaviours that come with deprivation.

    So who’s being blamed – NOW? :-) (no- not them) well not only them . . .

    I blame the system and EVERYONE for allowing an anti-human system to do these things to people.

    Now this could be bullshit of course but before you dismiss it as bullshit consider this -

    There are parts of the world where only up until recently – rape was unheard of.

    how come?

    because sex is not a commodity in those societies, its value is purely personal and biological – not commercial.

    No no porn industry, no cosmetics industry, no ‘white standards of beauty’, and no social isolation brought on by family breakdown – none of that shit.

    and gues what –

    no one gets raped.

    Food for thought I’d say.

    But if you’re a FASCIST, no-good doer, you’d rather control people with force than liberate them and make them SAFER with justice..

  • Cantarah

    There is a whole lot wrong with your “opinions” (in quotation marks for a reason) but I’ll just address this gem:

    “There are parts of the world where only up until recently – rape was unheard of.

    how come?

    because sex is not a commodity in those societies, its value is purely personal and biological – not commercial.”

    You made that up wholesale. There are indeed societies where until recently there was no such thing as rape. The reasons for that are many and varied but no reputable scientist has deduced any of them are the ridiculous reason you gave. In some of those societies there was no such thing as “rape” because women were obligated to have sex when the men demanded it (which means there was indeed rape by its technical definition just not a legal one) and in many of those groups rape was so incredibly stigmatized, such a horrific crime that a person could commit, that nobody wanted to take the risk of raping someone and being shunned, killed, or exiled from the group. It’s a shame we don’t take the latter approach in our own society but with people like you running around I guess it isn’t a surprise.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    cantarah

    Well there are flaws in every opinion – I guess that’s why they’re called opinions, but since many of mine of are unconventional and therefore mostly unheard, they at least deserve some air time.

    You’re talking about societies where rape is simply not acknowledged, nothing to do with what I’m talking about.

    I’m talking about societies where rape is unknown because no one rapes anyone, in any sense of the word – be that meaning to sexually violate someone or to exploit or violate them in some non-sexual way – because they are societies that have none of the exploitative systems that organize western ‘civilization’.

    In the few remaining hunter gatherer societies in Africa for example, where people still go about naked, no gets raped. Human relationships are egalitarian and consensual rather than hierachical and coercive.

    Go figure.

    :-)

  • iQgraphics

    @leonard Smalls

    Go and call 5 women you know. Now statistically 1-2 of the 5 women you call has either been raped, molested or sexually assulted. Now, when the 2 admit to the crimes committed against them, ask them were they dressed as whores or were they drunk.

    I’ll wait….

    OK, now go and call 5 more women you may know, this time call your daughter, your mother, your aunties and nieces. Ask them have they been raped. Once the 2 admit to the crimes committed against them, alert them to your generalization that their garb of choice was the de facto leading to what happened to them.

    Carry on

  • iQgraphics

    ALSO @leonard Small

    F YOUR I
    even whores, dressed as whores, and selling sex… umm… you still have to ask permission before you delve into their fruits of nature. Bring your wallet.

  • iQgraphics

    A YO! WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT
    IF I WAS A WHORE, DRESSED AS A WHORE, ON WHORE STREET, WITH A SIGN THAT SAYS “IM WHORING”
    YOU STILL HAVE TO ASK ME FOR THE AS$ .

    YOU CAN’T TAKE IT! AND YOU HAVE TO PAY!

    HELLO… MC FLY!!!??

  • Cantarah

    Your opinions can get airtime, that doesn’t mean they deserve a sugarcoated response. In the societies where rape was unheard of and still is rarely heard of, rape is an incredibly stigmatized crime. As I already explained. You trying to divorce the fact that in those societies rape is treated far more seriously and punished far more harshly than it is here and concluding (with no evidence) that that isn’t the reason there is no rape there, there is no rape there because you feel that sex there doesn’t carry any commodity aspects is a bridge ridiculously too far.

    But in the interests of fairness, how about you name a specific society to use as an example for your thesis.

  • isolde

    “the author never addressed what was so wrong about Champ’s post. his words do not even slightly suggest victim blaming.”

    @Ravi

    I mean why would Kirsten have a problem with another ““I don’t condone rape, but she shouldn’t have done x,y,z . . .” screeds ? So, you mean to tell me that because Kirsten didn’t preface her stance with the sentence, “This is what is wrong with Champ’s post . . .” You couldn’t grasp what she thought was wrong with Champ’s piece? What about that whole sixth paragraph? Did you just miss that?
    ____________________________________________________________________
    “Even though The Champ agrees that statistics revealing that 1 in 5 women will become victims of a completed or attempted rape in their lifetime are horrific, HE DRAWS THE LINE AT AGREEINGTHAT MEN, AND MEN ALONE, ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR WOMEN BEING VIOLATED.
    ____________________________________________________________________

    Champ writes . . .
    ____________________________________________________________________
    “Why can’t both genders be educated on how to act responsibility around each other? What’s stopping us from steadfastly instilling “No always means no!” in the minds of all men and boys and educating women how not to put themselves in certain situations? Of course men shouldn’t attempt to have sex with a woman who’s too drunk to say no, but what’s wrong with reminding women that if you’re 5’1 and 110 pounds, it’s probably not the best idea to take eight shots of Patron while on the first, second, or thirteenth date? Yes, sober women definitely get raped too, but being sober and aware does decrease the likelihood that harm may come your way, and that’s true for each gender.”
    ____________________________________________________________________

    DRUNK WOMAN AROUND MAN =/= MAN WHO ASSAULTS HER. Understand? Unless a drunk/intoxicated woman is assaulting someone, ala those chicks at McDonalds that got beat with the metal pole, then a woman being drunk around a man is not acting “irresponsibly” nor is her drunkenness on par with a man raping her, and yet right off the bat, Champ tries to equate the two by setting up that wack-@ss analogy “Why can’t both genders be educated on how to act responsibly around each other,” and then uses the “drunk rape” scenario to support his sh*t. Like really though, WTF? It’s a woman’s responsible duty towards a man not to be drunk around him because such female drunkenness provokes that man to rape her? For realsies?

    You can’t, on the one hand, reprimand women for provoking rape, or, in this case, point the finger at women for not using “common sense” (i.e. drinking Patron with the fellas, or whatever tacky @ss example Champ used) and then turn around and say that a victim isn’t at fault for being raped. By Champ’s logic, (and yours since you’re co-signing him), the victim would be at fault for provoking the rape, and that’s why such logic is victim blaming. There’s no gray area. It’s one or the other, fault or no fault, and Champ asserts that victims who “lack common sense” are in fact, partially to blame.

    Jaybee already touched on this before. You wanna have a discussion about self defense and personal safety, fine. You can do all that would without implicitly or explicitly blaming women for being raped, and that’s why Champ’s sh*tty @ss piece fails, because it conflates the two issues.

    And for you to be coming up in here with that car, door, lock, analogy, when the comment right above yours ( no less) just shoots that down. I mean . . . why? You’re usually a smarter cat, you know?

  • Cecily

    +1 YES!!

  • Cassie

    let me point the idiot who wrote this article about her over generalization of middle east. Its hilarious how you point out that woman are more likely to get raped in those countries when the highest rapes are committed in the united states of america.Rape can happen anywhere in th world so trying to scapegoat how woman who cover more are victimized is an over simplification.educate yourself every four minutes a woman in America is being sexually assulted lived in bahrain for four years and never felt the “victimization of women” in muslim countries but that doesnt mean it doesnt happen, there probably are cases that it does.

  • Ravi

    I was going to say the same thing about you, usually being smarter and all.

    “I mean why would Kirsten have a problem with another ““I don’t condone rape, but she shouldn’t have done x,y,z . . .” screeds ? So, you mean to tell me that because Kirsten didn’t preface her stance with the sentence, “This is what is wrong with Champ’s post . . .” You couldn’t grasp what she thought was wrong with Champ’s piece? What about that whole sixth paragraph? Did you just miss that?”

    I’m thinking you just didn’t understand what I wrote. that’s the only logical explanation for this response. I’m saying that the author did not show that Champ’s piece was wrong. the author did nothing to refute his primary point — that women can exert a measure of control over whether or not they are raped and that this fact has nothing to do with blame. nothing in the authors words invalidate any aspect of this point. this has nothing to do with prefacing her stance with that sentence.

    the excerpt you copied is exactly what i’m talking about. she isn’t refuting anything. she makes assertions about Champs whack analogy but then fails to actually make an argument as to why he might be wrong. the author completely missed the point. in order to properly refute Champ, she would need to show that a woman that gets drunk has no greater chance of being raped than a sober woman. She would also have to show that no action a woman can possibly take, could somehow diminish her probability of getting raped. The argument has nothing to do with provoking rape. that’s called a straw man argument. by my logic and by my explicit statement, a woman is NEVER AT FAULT FOR GETTING RAPED. any assertions you make to the contrary of my explicit statement is a failure on your part to understand my argument.

    this is a conversation about self defense. in no way shape or form did i blame anyone for being raped. my analogy was flawless, your comprehension of my analogy, apparently less so. and for you to come on here making comments and hurling insults when you clearly don’t even understand my point, I mean … why? I’m always a smarter cat. if you ever get the feeling otherwise, then you just aren’t understanding what i’m saying.

    when you want to have an intelligent conversation, then ask me for clarification on what you don’t get before making ASSumptions. also, before you respond, please go read up on the difference between but-for causation and proximate causation. you might actually understand what I’m talking about if you understand this distinction.

  • oneshot

    Why waste your time replying to his comment? You just supplied him with the fuel he needs to continue his crap. If you ignore him = no fuel= he will go away.

  • oneshot

    QUESTION…

    There have been many cases in my area (N. Chitown) of women who were drunk as a scunk walking alone after midnight being raped. After hearing these cases. am I wrong as a parent to say to my daughter, if you find yourself in that situation, call me, I will pick up no matter what? The reason why I would do that is because the possibility of rape, robbery, murder crosses my mind. The amount of education a man receives is not my concern when it comes to my child.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    cantarah

    Ok we’re going around in circles sweetie, coz you’re kinda – not listening, so have a look at this link, use it as an intro to further reading on the subject of -

    RAPE societies like the US vs

    NON-RAPE societies such as the Mbuti in Africa.

    http://www.csub.edu/~jgranskog/inst205/benderly.htm

  • Socially Maladjusted

    True, you being a whore means the only question someone has to ask is -

    how much?

    but then you kinda devalue yourself when you make yourself an object that can be bought – not the best way to teach other people how to treat you.

    Like I said get mad at me all you want but you aint stoppin rape anytime soon. If rape is as widespread as women claim -

    what you gonna do – lock every man up?

  • Socially Maladjusted

    cassie

    Good post

  • Cantarah

    Passive aggressive responses are in poor taste. FYI. I’m not your sweetie and you should be more appreciative that anyone is even bothering to respond to your ridiculousness.

    You seem to believe based on your own “opinions” and maybe one anthro class in college that you can rewrite the history of gender relations as the world knows it and nobody will know better. Mbuti society was indeed pretty much rape-free for a long time…and trying to divorce that from their overall attitude towards gender and their attitude that gender driven violence such as rape is totally unacceptable because it’s convenient for you to do so is reprehensible and has no basis in science. Any Mbuti man who raped a woman historically was driven out and thus starved to death – meaning they took rape seriously. They didn’t make excuses for it by saying “Well, if women would just not use sex as a COMMODITY they wouldn’t get raped.”

  • isolde

    “I’m thinking you just didn’t understand what I wrote.”

    @Ravi

    I’m thinking that you’re backtracking and better mansplaining yourself because the sentence of yours that I quoted and responded to “the author never addressed what was so wrong about Champ’s post. his words do not even slightly suggest victim blaming,” was pretty straightforward and easy to digest. What didn’t I understand about your saying that Champ’s words don’t even slightly suggest victim blaming? Now that I’ve solidly refuted all that, it’s “I’m thinking you just didn’t understand what I wrote” and “women can exert a measure of control over whether or not they are raped and that this fact has nothing to do with blame.”

    First of all, yeah, suggesting that women can exert a measure of control over whether or not they are raped does have to do with blame, and I’ve already explained why.

    And even Champ refutes his own premise when prior to launching into his “common sense” tirade he wrote, “I know that rapists are going to rape regardless of how women decide to dress, what (and how much) women decide to drink, where women decide to frequent, and what women decide to do. For rapists, all a woman needs to do to “ask for it” is be born.” . . .

    ____________________________________________________________________

    “in order to properly refute Champ, she would need to show that a woman that gets drunk has no greater chance of being raped than a sober woman. She would also have to show that no action a woman can possibly take, could somehow diminish her probability of getting raped. The argument has nothing to do with provoking rape.”
    ____________________________________________________________________

    Cute. And where are Champ’s numbers stating a drunk woman has a greater chance of being raped than a sober woman? Since “drunk rape” is the only rape scenario that Champ alludes to, then where’s his proof that the majority of reported rapes even involve alcohol? He provides no such evidence, but it’s so nice to know that Champ, with his one anecdote, is irrefutable and infallible unless Kirsten can offer empirical evidence that Champ himself never bothered to provide in the first place. Is there some reason why only Kirsten has to offer such evidence to be credible and not Champ? Let me guess. It’s because Champ wrote first, right? Oh, but then again, he didn’t because Champ was responding to another article written by someone else.So please explain to me why his opinion is supposed to hold so much more weight?

    While a large percentage of reported rapes in the US do involve alcohol where both assailant and victim had been drinking (47%), 17% of reported rapes occurred when just the assailant was drinking, and ONLY 7% of rapes occurred when only the rape victim had been drinking.

    http://www.hawaii.edu/hivandaids/Similarities_And_Differences_In_Women_s_Sexual_Assault_Experiences_Based_On_Tactics.pdf

    Based on those numbers, it’s the PERPS who run the risk of being irresponsible while intoxicated, not the victims, and that number (47%) is probably as high as it is because most of those drunk rapes occurred on college campuses, and arguably, there’s more attention paid to rape among college women than any other population demographic, but was Champ even referring (exclusively or otherwise) to college women when he offered his anecdote? After all, the median age of the average US woman in 2010 was 38, and how many college parties or dates among college students involve shots of high end, Patron brand tequila? That whole line alone, about the 5’1” woman and the Patron shots let me know, right then and there, that Champ was making up sh*t off the top of his head, but here you are co-signing it like it was gospel.

    What common sense measures should those victims who were raped without being under the influence have taken to “exert control” over the situation so they wouldn’t have been raped? And no, your car, door, analogy was far from flawless because most rape victims aren’t raped by strangers. So, the men most likely to rape your nieces are men they would already unlock their homes and car doors for anyway. And you’re talking about how Champ’s piece was about self defense, like Champ was telling women to take karate and carry mase (LOL). He told women to have “common sense” and stop getting drunk. The end.
    ____________________________________________________________________
    the excerpt you copied is exactly what i’m talking about. she isn’t refuting anything. she makes assertions about Champs whack analogy but then fails to actually make an argument as to why he might be wrong.
    ____________________________________________________________________

    Oh, you mean like page 2 of the article in the first paragraph where Kirsten pokes even more holes in Champ’s logic than in the sixth paragraph of the first page, when she writes . . .
    ___________________________________________________________________

    “It might behoove The Champ to understand that in some middle-eastern countries — where women are the most subjugated and cloaked — they face the most horrid and violent atrocities. Alpha-male domination disguised as religion and culture have paved the way for the rape of women to be deemed a man’s birthright, and speculation about what role a woman’s sobriety plays in her victimization only exacerbates this faulty logic.”
    ____________________________________________________________________

    Maybe those subjugated, cloaked, raped women were drinking, or they didn’t lock their car door, or their house door . . .

    Try reading the sentence in bold below which states, “Lack of common sense should not cancel out common courtesy and respect.” then refer back to Champ’s paragraph about how supposedly lacking “common sense” makes women partially culpable in their own assaults. Then, read the sentence after that where Kirsten writes,
    ____________________________________________________________________“Thinking anything to the contrary (women aren’t responsible, not even partially responsible, for being raped) is archaic and dangerous, and suggests that men are incapable of rational thought. The only thing that separates humans from animals is conscience – and by The Champ’s definition, men should not be expected to have one by default.”
    ____________________________________________________________________

    I mean, I could continue, but if I do, I’ll run the risk of highlighting the article in full.

  • Ravi

    I thought it was pretty easy to digest also, but your reply doesn’t make sense as any sort of refutation of my argument. The sentence you stated as a preface to the original authors post makes no sense if you understand what I was actually stating here. The only explanation that I could come up with for your reply is that you just didn’t understand what I meant. No need to back track, just go back and make sure that what I originally stated was clear.

    when you stated “You couldn’t grasp what she thought was wrong with Champ’s piece?” this also showed that you didn’t understand what I was saying. I clearly grasped what she thought was wrong with Champ’s piece. I’m saying she never made an actual argument to refute it. There is a difference between saying that Champ’s piece is wrong and actually making an argument that refutes what Champ was saying. My point is that the author never actually made an argument.

    You quoted two of my sentences and it should have been pretty clear based on my last message, which of the the two sentences I didn’t think you understood. I never stated that you didn’t understand that I was maintaining that Champ wasn’t victim blaming. You still haven’t refuted a thing. show me where Champ’s statements blamed rape victims.

    suggesting that a woman can exert a measure of control over whether or not she is raped absolutely does not constitute blaming the victim. You have offered no argument that supports such an assertion. if what you were saying were true, women would not be encouraged to take self defense classes, scream out for help when being attacked, walk home from classes in groups at night, not accept open drinks from anyone, etc. All of these actions reduce the likelihood of being raped, therefore empowering a woman to exert a measure of control over whether or not she is raped. so unless advising women to do any of the above actions constitutes victim blaming, then you are wrong. That would be an argument. Here is RAINN’s material on more ways to reduce the chances of being raped:

    http://rainn.org/get-information/sexual-assault-prevention

    Is RAINN blaming the victims by putting out such info?

    and what premise did he refute? that quote shows exactly how he is not blaming the victim. he explicitly states that women are not asking to be raped no matter what they do. this pretty much proves my point.

    logic is always cute. champ doesn’t need numbers to substantiate that claim. his claims about alcohol have nothing to do with the majority of rapes. if even one woman gets raped while drunk, then his statements are valid. I never said that she has to offer evidence, i said she has to offer an argument. She never bothered to. attempting to refute someone’s argument can’t be done by just saying “you are wrong.” you are once again, completely mischaracterizing what I argued. bringing up evidence doesn’t even make sense in light of what I wrote. Champ’s logical flow connects his premises that women that aren’t drunk have a lower a chance of getting raped and that there are actions that women can perform in general that reduce the chances to of getting raped to his assertions that common sense would lead a woman to protect herself in any way she can. in order to challenge his argument you would need to find some mistake of logic or simply to deny his premises. This has nothing to do with evidence. As I was saying before, you just didn’t understand what I was saying.

    the relative numbers of drunk to not drunk rapes have nothing to do with my argument. if .0001% of rapes occur with the survivor being drunk, it still would not touch my argument. you are completely missing the point. statistics have nothing to do with his argument nor mine for that matter. the only question is, does being sober reduce an individuals likelihood of being raped? Are you really arguing that a sober woman has a better chance of fending off an attacker than an unconscious drunk woman?

    the basis of comparison of my analogy had nothing to do with strangers, so yes, my analogy was flawless. It was comparing the fact that even though actions can be taken to prevent a crime, the victim is still not to blame. The fact that you brought up strangers shows that you simply did not understand the analogy. as for the common sense measures a woman can take to reduce the chances of being raped, visit the link above or just google sexual assault prevention. the very existence of sexual assault prevention groups demonstrates that women can be empowered to reduce their likelihood of being raped.

    it’s not about the men that are most likely to rape my nieces, it’s about decreasing the likelihood of being raped in any given situation. I’m not saying that Champ’s piece was about self defense; i’m saying that the logical extension of your criticism is like saying that self defense is useless in preventing rape. any refutation of Champ’s piece is necessarily arguing that women can do nothing to reduce their chances of being raped. if self defense can help women fend off attackers, then what champ says has validity. he didn’t list all of the measures that could be taken to reduce the chances of being raped and his argument didn’t require that he do so. His argument just holds as an axiom that women can do something to reduce their chances of being raped. that could mean self defense, but it could also mean not drinking to the point of passing out in a room full of strangers.

    i’m looking for any point in time where she pokes holes in his logic. She fails to do so and seems to miss the point much like you seem to. the quote about middle eastern women has no impact on Champ’s argument. in what way does it refute anything? how does this show that an unconscious drunk woman has less a chance to fend off a rapist than a sober woman? it just demonstrates that the author doesn’t understand the points of contention.

    read that sentence before. that’s what i’ve been talking about. that statement does not address what Champ actually stated. He isn’t arguing that a woman has culpability. you made that up. nowhere in the paragraphs quoted above does he even slightly suggest that a woman is culpable in being raped. this is what you call a straw man argument. nobody is talking about blame. he is arguing for taking common sense measures that the author even agrees should be taken.

    “Yes, it is reasonable, even necessary, to teach our young girls common sense; but, it is not reasonable that we must do so because the mere sight of their breasts and drunken state brings forth urges so strong that men can’t help but viciously attack at the slightest hint of vulnerability.”

    she should have stopped after the common sense, because that was the entire point. teach girls commons sense. that’s it. all this other stuff about a woman being blamed for her own rape doesn’t make sense. no one is arguing that.

    so, yeah. please do continue. you still have yet to refute anything from Champ’s piece or anything I’ve said. You are just attempting to put words in my mouth and completely mischaracterize the argument.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    cantarah

    You’re responding to what i’ve said because you percieved it as threatening enough to your assumptions, prejudices and hatreds to challenge – so don’t act like you’re doing me a favour -

    sweetie.

    oops – woman.

    I see your kind of ‘flog em , castrate and hang em’ ideas re. how rape should be dealt with as threatening enough to want to challenge them which is why I contributed to this discussion.

    So

    you’re saying that rape doesn’t happen Mbuti society because rapists are expelled from the tribe.

    Uh?

    The only reason rape doesn’t happen in a society is that the punishment for it excludes the criminal from society?

    Well you have the death penatly in the states for murder and expulsion penalties for rape (jail) where people are removed from society and yet America has the highest murder and rape rates in the world.

    Ok let’s say America sent all its rapists to live in Canada, by your reasoning – that would end rape in America.

    pah – this is silly,

    you’re too angry to be reasoned with.

    And btw – I didn’t say that women are to blame for rape, I said –

    “I blame the system and EVERYONE under its subjection, for allowing an anti-human system to do these things to people.”.

  • iQgraphics

    @SM
    I’m not mad at you. I wasnt even replying to you. @oneshot assumed that

    But your comment has no value. It does not address taking what is not yours, whether I price my goods or not.

    Devalue, value or evaluate, it’s not yours for the taking.

    I was commenting to leonard small. my post just happened to come after yours.

    don’t TAKE it personal

  • Socially Maladjusted

    But your comment has no value. It does not address taking what is not yours, whether I price my goods or not.

    Oh so “raping” a whore is only a crime against property – theft?

    then the punishment for stealing sex from a whore should be same as you’d get for stealing an apple from a store –

    $2 fine, with time to pay.

    LOL!

    smh

  • Socially Maladjusted

    ..
    But your comment has no value. It does not address taking what is not yours, whether I price my goods or not.

    Oh so “raping” a whore is only a crime against property – theft?

    then the punishment for stealing sex from a whore should be same as you’d get for stealing an apple from a store –

    $2 fine, with time to pay.

    LOL!

    smh

  • chinaza

    People only need to understand one thing. Rape is not about sex but a violent dehumanization of a person. The sexual act could just as easily be replaced by a gun.
    So the victim of a rape is no more liable than the victim of a murder.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    then the punishment for stealing sex from a whore should be same as you’d get for stealing an apple from a store

    This is not accurate.

    There is no punishment for stealing sex from a whore because whoring is illegal.

    The law cannot be used to enforce illegal contracts.

    So nobody has to pay a whore a damn thing.

  • Plem50

    This is such a ridiculous argument it astounds me. And we have it over and over again.

    Possibly this might be a problem with intent and tone. There’s clearly a big difference between a man saying:

    1. That bitch wouldn’t have gotten raped if it she wasn’t dressing like a slut!

    versus

    2. A woman is not responsible for her rape, but there are clearly certain risk factors that increase her chances of being raped such as jogging at midnight in the bad part of town.

    #1 is only said by a small minority of ignorant men or trolls, #2 is what a majority of men are saying. Feminists seem to only hear the #1′s.

    The only reason this issue is so complicated is because of female privilege. I recently saw a video of a man telling a group of young men to stop talking or something and they responded by beating him up. The blogger who posted it said it was terrible what happened but at the same time the guy should’ve known better than to tell a group of shady looking guys with tattoos and all that to be quiet.

    Was that victim blaming? No, I don’t think it was. It’s just common sense, we feel sorry for the guy at the same time he could’ve easily avoided his fate by using some common sense. This is all what men (and many women too) are saying about rape minus the jerks who post ignorant stuff like #1 which all reasonable men disagree with.

    Also, RAPE IS ABOUT SEX. The meme that Rape is about Power, not Sex is just feminist propoganda. Because if you’re a feminist it’s not in your interest if rape is framed as sex or lust because then it would be something inherent in the nature of men and that’s impossible to eradicate. But if it’s the patriarchy/rape culture causing men to rape women then that’s something that can be overthrown.

    If rape is about power and not sex why are rapists overwhelmingly young men (when their urge to have sex is strongest) and most victims of rape are overwhelmingly women in their peak productive years (between 15-35)?

    And if you’re going to counter my last point please give me a study, not some personal anecdote about some old guy who raped or a old woman who got raped, we’re talking about the AGGREGATE.

  • Kaya

    Agreed! I often wonder why is this such an issue? Why is there so much back and forth an heated discussion on such a simple topic. As long as there is evil in the world we can never live in a utopian society which means we are always going to have to do our part in protecting ourselves. That mean we should attempt to conduct ourself in a way were we are consciously aware of our surroundings-in the end if one is victimize its not their fault but lets do all WE CAN to keep ourself safe because honey, If someone attempts to rape me i won’t go down without a fight!

  • iQgraphics

    You can’t take what’s not yours.
    That’s stealing.

    That’s as simple as I can put it for you.
    Little kids can understand that.

  • Kaya

    A lot Middle eastern countries do have low crime/theft rate because of its high corporal punishment laws. In Korea, for example, one can leave their bags on a table in the middle of a crowded mall and not worry so much about theft than you would in America. Actually, the idea of doing that in the USA without someone watching them is ludicrous. So, harsher punishment perhaps will bring down a lot of crime rate here but because of its inhumane ways will never pass.

  • Socially Malasjusted

    @ ?iq

    >i>looking directly into your eyes and smiling benignly with a tinge of sadness and regret

    I hate it when I win so easily – feels like I “took” everything from someone who had little to give.

    poor ting.

    Must remember to only unleash the power stored in ethical black manhood in defence of The Weak

    not

    against Them.

  • iQgraphics

    What did you win?
    You cannot take what is not yours.

    What did you win?
    And what are you talking about.
    I am not ignorant, I don’t understand your comment.

    What did you win?
    Please elaborate

    Did you win something that wasn’t yours?
    What did you win?

  • yepok
  • MarloweOverShakespeare

    A friend just gave me this today, and I think it brilliantly summed up our thoughts on this topic…

    “If you lock the door to your house, it doesn’t necessarily prevent your house from being trespassed and burglarized. If that happens, of course its not your fault. But it’s still good to lock your door.”

  • anontoo

    by that idiotic reasoning, i guess women should lock their p ussies.

    and people who live in “bad neighboorhoods” should have multiple locks…or maybe they should just move into a white neighborhood…

    i hope your friend understands that locking up the house may prevent entry, but the p ussy is open, no matter what you have around it

    so much for analogies

  • MarloweOverShakespeare

    Your goods are “open,” so you can’t take precaution by keeping yourself out of situations that may lead to forced entry? That was what the analogy was about. It’s about basic common sense and good judgement. Refusing to acknowledge that women (along with every human being) need these two things to SURVIVE, is detrimental to YOUR safety.

    That is, if you care about it.

  • Pingback: Feminist Care Packages: Healing Love for Hard Times « The Crunk Feminist Collective

  • M

    You are truly derailing like a champ.

  • Echo

    The only thing that causes rape is rapists. There is nothing a woman can or can’t do that would stop a rape if she is with a rapist. Old women are raped, children are raped, women who wear shorts and t-shirts are raped, women who wear skirts are raped, women who wear jeans and a sweatshirt are raped. Women are raped on streets, in cars, in parks, in schools, in libraries, in stadiums, in fields, in barns and in their homes (among other places), *and* whether it is daytime or not. Women can be raped in empty uninhabited areas or in the middle of a crowd. Beautiful women are raped, ugly women are raped, fat women are raped, skinny women are raped- in any outfit choice. Drunk women, sober women, and sometimes, though men don’t like to think about it- men are raped, too (in any of the above scenarios).

    What is the common denominator here? A rapist. That’s it.

    You could take every precaution in the world and still be raped. And the sad part about that? The victim would STILL be raked over the coals for not having done “something” to keep themselves safer. The only crimes that don’t get prosecuted and punished because of victim-blaming is sexual assault. Everyone is pretty much on the same page when it comes to murder (Hint: Murder bad). But rape? Maybe she shouldn’t have been there, wearing that, drinking that, talking that way….

Latest Stories

10 Questions No One Will Ask Ex-Boxing Champ Kassim Ouma After Assaulting a Man Who Came On To Him

by

10 Things We Can Learn From Olivia Pope On “Scandal”

by

Struggling To Tell Black People Apart? Watch David Alan Grier Hilariously Break It Down

by

Carol’s Daughter Files For Bankruptcy

by
Read previous post:
What Is Your Worth, Literally?
Better to Be Friends or Immediately Go for the Relationship?
Close