There has been a lot of talk about single mothers lately. From proposed laws aiming to criminalize single parenthood, to the startling statistics hurled at black women that 70% of our children are born to unwed parents, the conversations around single motherhood has become a hot topic and a tool to shame many women. But one popular vlogger thinks the conversation needs to change.

After she was informed that many people on a women’s forum were taking shots at her single motherhood status, entrepreneur, natural hair vlogger and media personality Taren Guy decided to respond.

In a video titled “Are Single Mothers Damaged Goods?!” Guy takes aim at those who feel like single mothers are less desirable, less worthy, and less able to find love. In the clip Guy shares her story of being a newly single mom and drops a few inspirational words for those who may be in her shoes.

Check it out & share your thoughts.

  • Yb

    I never understand why the women who stand up alone, work their hardest, and raise their children at many times, WELL are seen as damaged goods and inferior.

    Smh

  • kissa

    I wish we had a beat the dead horse emoticon..

  • jamesfrmphilly

    i’ll take some of dem dere goods………

  • QCastle

    @Yb

    In 2012 women make a decision to become single mothers. It isnt a challenge in life that was inadvertent. Its not Lou Gehrig’s disease. In addition men dont want to raise another man’s child. Chalk it up to some type of territorial psychology. The more children you have the farther down the scale of men are who are willing to deal with you. Most men who have theirs together dont want to deal with that baggage because they simply dont have to. There are so many other women out there who dont have children.

  • QCastle

    I dont want my son to be with a woman who already has children with someone else. Exceptions can be made ONLY for a woman who was previously married and now widowed.

  • Donald K Sumner

    They are damaged goods because they became single mothers after f***ing some DIRTBAG simply because he was tall/athlete/baller/gangster/thug/bad boy/swag boy/player

  • Donald K Sumner

    Great criteria, make sure it STICKS!

  • Yb

    @Queen of Newcastle aka Kigali

    I have read the venomous misplaced hatred you spew towards black women in this site as well as others. You can take to anti-black women rhetoric and choke on it. I will not entertain your foolishness. Do not respond to my comments on this article or others, EVER.

    @Donald K

    Get over the bitterness of rejection you have faced in life. Clutch magonline is not the therapy couch and the women who frequent this site a not therapists. Get Help.

  • Yb

    @Queen of Newcastle aka Kigali

    I have read the venomous misplaced hatred you spew towards black women in this site as well as others. Next address the topic in comment instead of resorting to projecting. You can take to anti-black women rhetoric and choke on it. I will not entertain your foolishness. Do not respond to my comments on this article or others, EVER.

    @Donald K

    Get over the bitterness of rejection you have faced in life. Clutch magonline is not the therapy couch and the women who frequent this site a not therapists. Get Help.

  • Liz

    …do you want your daughter to be with a man who has children?

    Let me guess…some black woman trapped him, stole his semen, and impregnated herself and is now keeping him from seeing his child because black women are evil and that’s what they do… so he gets a pass and is allowed to date your daughter…right, Q?

  • Donald K Sumner

    @Liz,

    No to you first question.

    Second, women control sex at every level, scientific fact…

  • Liz

    Donald, with all due respect, that was aimed at Qon, and it was flavored with a heavy dose of sarcasm. Read her comments, and you’ll know where it comes from.

  • Tonton Michel

    Come on now, there are no laws calling to criminalize single parenthood or calling single mothers damaged goods. Whats being called out is the turning of the eye to repeated irresponsible behavior and viewing raising a child in a single parent home as equal and beneficial to the child as if they were in a two parent home. What this woman is talking about in her vid is about her own relationships and different from what has been coming across this site.

  • Liz

    Donald…you are a grade A jackass. My grandmother became a widow at the age of 33 with 4 young children and one on the way (my mama) and my mother became a widow at the age of 50 with 2 young children. I guess they are damaged goods because they became single mothers after (marrying) and f***ing some pretty awesome gentlemen who 1) drove cars and 2) became afflicted with cancer.

    I don’t pretend that this is EVERYONE’S story, but judging someone before KNOWING their story is DISGUSTING.

    When you starts measuring someone, measure him right.

  • Liz

    You’re probably the only man who frequents this site that has any kind of sense.

  • LAD86

    At this point in time, I think Clutch is posting these articles because they know it will bring out the crazies and their minions and get a high comment count.

  • LAD86

    At this point in time, I think this site is posting these articles because they know it will bring out the crazies and their minions and get a high comment count.

  • Liz

    yeah….I agree. Motherhood, interracial dating, disease rates of black womenfolk. Clutch knows how to keep their ad revenue up.

  • Liz

    yeah….I agree. Motherhood, interracial dating, disease rates of black womenfolk. They knows how to keep their ad revenue up.

  • random

    You are both right.

  • Keep it Real

    Three kids, never married and no man…. yeah, ok. I see she disabled her comments. I wonder why? Please don’t compare baby mammas to divorced women. Big difference! If the man loves the woman, there’s a good chance he’s going to love, provide for the child emotionally and financially. If he doesn’t love the woman, there’s a 50/50 chance he’s not going care about the child. Yes the black divorce rate is high but what is the separation rate of baby mammas? It’s got to be close to 90%. Black men do not marry their baby mammas which is why black women have the highest percentage of multiple baby daddies of any race. American Black Women are the only culture and race of UNMARRIED women in the WORLD including Africa who blame their pregnancy (he should have used a condom) on men. This is the end result of the liberal victimization ideology. Throughout history up to the present all other races and cultures hold the UNMARRIED women responsible for her pregnancy. There is a reason for that right or wrong, it works! Most of these black babymamma kids are from short term hookups with an immature bum, player or thug/convict. Stop asking black men to do what no other race of men is willing to do. Marry, and raise a family with a woman they don’t give a shyt about. If you get pregnant by a bum, player or thug/convict, don’t expect him to change just because you had a baby. You knew who he was before you laid with him. You are responsible for your body, You!!!! And no one else! Too many black women are making stupid excuses about condoms for the reason they’re pregnant or had a baby by a bum. Yes the man is equally responsible for the baby but he is not equally responsible for the pregnancy. Good luck with equal responsibility from a bum, player or thug/convict. That’s your body. The courts have even given women the right to abort with or without the man’s consent. Black men and women are not having anymore nor less sex, UNPROTECTED SEX, than men and women of other races, however, black women have 2 to 3 times the amount of abortions and illegitimate kids. Why? Black women embraced “Free Love” the social movement of liberals and white feminist which rejected marriage before sex (ie sexual revolution, sexual freedom or sex before marriage). In other words, poor black women started having sex like white women but weren’t taking the pill like white women. The pill and birth control empowered white women and gave them control over their bodies. Poor black women got the sex memo, however, they didn’t read the fine print at the bottom “must take the pill”. Their inability or unwillingness to consistently and correctly take female contraceptives caused an exp1osion of black illegitimacy and black abortions. These white feminist weren’t abandoned because they waited to get married before having kids. Who then is left to teach a black boy the importance of marriage? I guess he has to learn by osmosis. Black Baby mammas have very little or no interest in their sons marrying and treating a woman better than the baby mammas sons father ever treated her.

    People don’t care about single mothers just because of some old outdated traditions. Our problem is high Illegitimacy leads to high academic failure, high academic failure leads to high drop out rates, high drop out rates leads to high rates of unemployment, high rates of unemployment leads to high rates of poverty, high rates of poverty leads to high rates of crime. All of which lead to dysfunctional homes and dysfunctional communities. After three to four generations of legions of baby mamma kids running wild terrorizing the black community and having more baby mama kids. We now know the truth. Emasculated black men refuse to admit it and black women will fight tooth and nail and will try to shout anyone down whenever it’s mentioned that the great matriarchal utopia society that the white liberals and feminist promised you is a lie. There has never been a productive nation with 72% illegitimacy and no men in the home in the history of civilization, by any race. IT CAN NOT BE DONE. Remember from 1900 to 1960 in spite of Jim Crow Laws, discrimination and racism the black illegitimacy was between 10 to 24% and the black community was extremely stable. In many decades black women married at a higher rate than white women and almost every black kid lived in a home with their father, fact. Lets look at the current matriarchal black community. This includes cities that have been run by white liberals and blacks liberals for the last 50 years from the school board to the Mayors office. No black men in the home, black women have went from the highest to the lowest marriage rates of any race (31% of African American women by their early forties have never married as compared to only 9% of White, 11% of Asian, and 12% of Latino women in the same age group). The black community now has 72% illegitimacy, 50% abortions of all black pregnancies, overcrowding of abandoned/abused black kids in CPS, 50% H.S. dropout rate, extremely high crime, unemployment and very few black businesses. Liberalism, progressive, socialism and feminism has failed the black community. Everything conservative ain’t bad and everything liberal ain’t good.

    Can a child raised by a single parent become productive? OF COURSE THEY CAN! Can a community with 72% of it’s kids become productive? I haven’t seen any evidence of this in the history of civilization by any race. Have you? So the point must be made and repeated often. This is not about your son or daughter this is about the community as a whole. Who cares if 2 or 3 black kids out of 10 become successful and productive if the remaining 7 black kids fall through the cracks and perish? The community is still going to be dysfunctional. Blacks have lost their sense of community and now it’s all about me and mine. I got mine……. mine went college. The funny thing is we never here on these blogs and utube from the baby mama who had 4 kids, one is a drug addict, another has a bunch of kids by a bunch of different men, another is in jail for assault/murder and the last one she doesn’t know where in the hell he’s at. Maybe this is a little extreme but not by much.

  • ogawdDee

    who he sleeps with won’t be up to you…that’s when you take the titty out his mouth so he can make decisions for himself.

  • rosie

    DING, DING!

  • Vera

    Unfortunately, I have to agree with you. Single mothers that aren’t divorced or widowed tend to be damaged goods. Today, women have access to all sorts of contraceptives. Yes, ladies the burden falls on us the most as we are the ones that have to carry the baby for 9 months.

    On Taren, no comment.. 3 kids..not married, different fathers. Yes, you are definitely damaged goods.

  • LemonNLime

    OMG this video is too long. I’m not watching all of this. I’m with LAD86, Clutch stays on these types of articles, good Lord.

    I can’t speak for women because I don’t pursue romantic relationships with women but I can say this to me, men with kids, are NOT an option. Men who have kid(s) in marriage but are single because of divorce or death respectable, still don’t want to have anything to do with them, but if you have kid(s) all over the place I wouldn’t touch you with a 50ft pole. Men like that reak of irresponsibly, lack of forethought, and just triflin’. I am not trying to be a mother to anyone else’s kids nor would I want any resources being taken away from my child to support someone else’s kids (not that I am trying to have kids away).

  • Rosey

    This is a difficult subject for me. My Mom was a single mom and did her best to provide for me and my brother. Now many of my peers from high school are single mothers (I’m 25). Many of them come off as damaged goods via social media sights talking about they can’t find a good man. Let’s be real, most men don’t want to play daddy to your kids. This may sound harsh but… go to Planned Parenthood until there is a strong possibility you’ll get married. Until then, I’m blocking your complaining @$$. You knew RayRay was no good when he knocked you up.

  • EbonyLolita

    LemonNLime PREACH!!! I’ve tried to be fair & date a few “single fathers.” But truth be told it was Toooooo much. I found that they’re either looking for somebody to take care of their children or do less & blame YOU for being selfish b/c you don’t “understand my situation.” The last guy I dated I found out that he was a “single father” of two but had a 3rd child out there. HONEY…… the children were only a few yrs apart. I ran for the HILLS!! You want ME to sacrifice to deal w/your schedule due to YOUR irresponsible past? No boo, I’m out b/c I’m a single, carefree woman that does NOT play those type of games.
    Single mothers tend to be a lil overwhelmed but that normally comes from lack of support of the fathers. I think society sees this as being “damaged goods.” But truth be told my single mother friends go out on more dates then I do so *Shrugs* C’mon somebody wants them.

  • binks

    I saw this video and the followup, I am not going to knock her because she is talking about her life and experiences not all single mothers nor is she praising being a single mother or demanding to be put on a pedestal. Do I think single mothers are damages goods, no because like it or not we ALL have baggage, some more than others, but nobody goes through this life without being damage in some way. The key is finding someone who accepts your baggage. Now is it a bit harder for single mothers, particularly black single mothers, in the dating pool compare to women without children….yes when people think of single mothers there are stereotypes and negative perception concerning these women so the slope is harder but they aren’t damage solely because of it. Hate to say but I don’t think the majority of men would deal with a woman with a kid let alone multiple kids with different fathers especially if he don’t have kids. So the dating pool for them is already narrow, it’s not impossible but harder. The best thing Taren Guy can do is teach her daughter not to follow her route….

  • me

    I won’t go so far as to say they are damaged but in all honesty not many ppl are willing to date/ marry someone who already has kids..(unless the man and woman both have had children and they date each other so it doesn’t matter)

    I give a huge round of applause to the woman or man who dates/ marries someone with children. it’s not cut out for everyone..

    Lord, knows I will never EVER marry a dude with children. That’s one of my first questions when I meet someone… so we can nip it in the bud EARLY!

  • me

    i previously commented before watching the video…

    yes, multiple children with more than one father?!?! damaged goods, sweetie.

    You just don’t even care what happens when you have sex with someone.

    Like, why choose to be a single mother???

    1 is a mistake and someone can rock with you having ONE CHILD but 3 you’re a fool. THREE CHILDREN BY THREE DIFFERENT MEN?!?!?!

    WTH?!?!

  • Shut up

    I’m not a single mother, I’m already married and have no kids. But, I think a lot of these comments from these black men and women indicate that THEY are the damaged goods. You all are projecting your negativity. But have you ever considered that many throughout the entire world already consider you all damaged goods just because your black?
    So before you go and judge another individual for mistakes that they made in their past. Keep in mind that you really are not far off from the same critique…and no one cares that “its not your fault for being black.” Yeah…well your still considered damaged goods. So shut up.

  • kaya

    Your post–was too beautiful…..

  • apple

    Single moms are the product of the man that left them

    i’m sure they would be happy for the dad to be around, and not everyone is picking loser men sometimes people can appear to be a good but aren’t really. everyone should have had experience to people who appear to be one way but aren’t

    now women with multiple fathers all i can say is condoms, birth control, and abortion clinics.. i dont know what else to say in reference to that.

  • Yeahright2011

    Screw the community and this ridiculous racial shaming. Contraception and screening is more practical than rhetoric.

  • Elle Michelle

    “I think a lot of these comments from these black men and women indicate that THEY are the damaged goods. You all are projecting your negativity.”

    Round of applause. I agree.

  • sunshyne84

    ^exactly smdh

  • sunshyne84

    right *sigh*

    If someone doesn’t like that you have kids keep it movin. *shrug* That special person will find you. As with anything else…

  • sunshyne84

    My sister got married with 3 kids and he had none.

  • QoNewC

    @Liz

    I wouldnt mind my daughter being with a single father for the same reasons that women are more likely to adopt a child not their own and because women are far less threatening to the physical and sexual well being of a child. I dont know if you know this but non biological men have posed a significant risk to children both physically and sexually to children. Either as step fathers, boyfriends, especially live in boy friends, there has been a rash of physical and sexual abuse, even murderers of children by mommies new stud. Non biological women dont pose that same risk. As a child advocate first and foremost I would have to advise my son that isnt just not good news to be around children not your own.

  • QoNewC

    @Keep It Real

    I have to disagree with you about some divorced women. Most women are divorcing their husbands- breaking up the family -for reasons that have nothing to do with major deal breakers like abuse, neglect, drug or alcohold abuse, infidelity, etc. Therefore I would first have to enquire about the reasons for the divorce before I could make a judgement. In my mind any woman that would break up her family- disrupting the relationship between the father and his children is, in my mind, just as foolish, selfish and damaged as a single mother.

  • QoNewC

    @Shut Up

    Wow, comparing being born black to purposely having a child(ren) without an intact family? I think you should follow your namesake.

  • QoNewC

    @apple

    “Single moms are the product of the man that left them”

    No, single mothers are the product of women having children while single. The men cant leave because you can only leave if you are legally married. If you arent married, you are single. Even if the dad did “stay around” she would still be a single mom. The facts are even if the single father is involved, if he isnt leaving in the same home his presence in his child’s life, is severely limited and insufficient.

  • QoNewC

    @sunshyne

    Exceptions prove the rule.

  • perplexed

    i feel you Lemon, word-for-word i really do…

  • CurlySue

    @QCastle: Are you saying that, as a child advocate first and foremost, you wouldn’t want your son dating a woman with children because your son might physically or sexually assault the kids? That’s what your argument sounds like. Also, why would you be ok with your daughter taking on the burden of raising children not of her flesh but not your son? Certainly doesn’t seem fair in that regard.

  • TheBestAnonEver, Part 2

    If Taren wanted a guy today, she will have one. All these men blabbing rubbish on this site would be the first in line.

    That is all.

  • TJ

    Sometimes the idiots that comment on this blog lack a lot to be intellectually desired. Continuously spitting stereotypes? Really? Get some intellectual capacity. Yes some women do choose to have children a parent alone, the same way that women choose to have abortions. Parenthood and motherhood should not be seen as a consequence of come terrible choice one made. Societally this is a cultural stereotype that people continue to reinforce with their idiotic comments. Marriage is not the end all be all. A lot of women don’t choose to get a divorce, often times they are forced due to infidelity, domestic violence, pedophillia, financial mismanagement, etc. Women have children and can’t control their spouses no more than women who don’t have children and can’t control their spouses. Just because a woman reaches 35 with no children and no husband does not mean that she didn’t have to make very tough decisions, or even very life altering decisions that has made her emotionally ‘damaged goods.’

    Each person should be looked at differently in each circumstance.

  • Perspective

    From the view point of single childless men, single mothers (not divorced or widowed) are damaged goods.

    I’ve watched all the videos and how do you uplift one group of women without condoning their behavior.

    Do single baby mamas have the same value as childless women? Absolutely not and they shouldn’t, why? Because if that’s what you’re saying how do you expect to have young women see the value in being childless.

    I think the problem are that many single mothers are trying to redefine what should be valued in the black community, and it most certainly should not be single mothers.

    I’m not saying that these would should be put down, but they should be just like in every other community – put in the back row, when it comes to how you want to advertise how things SHOULD be in the black community.

    We need to get these women OUT of the forefront just like we need to get PRECIOUS and other oversized women out of the forefront when we’re trying to combat the white beauty standard or the idea that black women are unattractive.

    We promote the wrong stuff and in the process we bring the bar wayyyyyy down and then can’t understand why the rates of what’s considered negative in any other community are so much higher in our community, obviously poverty arguments not withstanding. Those are factors, but I believe our promotion or condoning some of these behavior to make a minority of women feel good about their situation does more damage than good.

    ALL these women are not victims, many just made poor choices just as the man did, or they knew the man wasn’t really solid and grounded when they got with him. Rarely do I see baby fathers that are really solid men, going some where and it makes me wonder why these women are sleeping with those men.

    I’d rather see black women put their foot down and reject these men all day. And when the guy got to complaining I would simply say, “Hey bro! cut all that “Oh she’s a gold digger stuff out,” you ain’t got it together. Period.”

    But I can’t correct these men when women are not only sleeping with them, but still having babies by them.

  • Stanley

    I want to build a family of my own. I don’t want to help someone raise a family they’ve started building before me.

  • Awalkinmyshoes

    Get a life really. Im divorced and a single mom…doing it on my own. He and I are better people today than when we were married and he had 4 kids BEFORE we married from his 1st marriage. I loved him and his kids…still do! How DARE YOU label people as damaged goods! You don’t know how these people came about their families…if you don’t want to deal with us then get to stepping. Ain’t nobody holding you hostage to date someone with kids!!! If you can’t love me and love my kids please pass me by…you are doing ME a favor really. And truth be told…alot of women WITHOUT kids can be just as disturbed as anyone else. Honestly, I’ve NEVER encountered a man that has an issue with childeren. I believe it’s because my mindset is….I’m not looking for you to save me or my kids. My home is totally comfortable and fine….with or without.

  • Liz

    CurlySue…that’s exactly what she’s saying. I for one wouldn’t be surprised if Qon’s children turned out to be predators.

  • Liz

    Thank you… Taren is a beautiful and she has “the look” (let’s not pretend). All of these men agreeing with the damaged goods rhetoric would be nipping at her feet if they had the chance.

  • Priceless34

    Thank you.
    No one is condemning single women.
    People just need to understand the residual shorterm and generational consequences of having children out of wedlock or with deadbeat men.

  • Perspective

    “Awalkinmyshoes
    MARCH 16, 2012 AT 9:29 AM
    Get a life really. Im divorced and a single mom…doing it on my own. He and I are better people today than when we were married and he had 4 kids BEFORE we married from his 1st marriage. I loved him and his kids…still do! How DARE YOU label people as damaged goods! ”

    Awalk – Once you get over your anger read this.

    First off we are talking about CHILDLESS MEN, which to my understand is what sparked the whole debate in the first place. There isn’t really an argument for a man WITH CHILDREN to stand on, but from the angle of a CHILDLESS MAN, yes, unfortunately you are not going to be his first choice, and this is what many single moms get upset about because there may be some guy out there that she things is great but she doesn’t want to believe that she’s going to be automatically disqualified from his dating pool.

    People with children should be getting with people with children – its just that simple. If a childless man decides to take on a woman with children from a previous relationship more power to him, or if a woman does the same thing – great, but it should be known that SINGLE MOTHERHOOD should not be promoted as some normal state of the black family. If it doesn’t apply let it fly, and judging by what you wrote it doesn’t fly so why are you bent out of shape?

  • niki

    Only thing I’m saying is “I’d rather humble myself than have God humble me”.

  • Perspective

    Gentleman

    Our women play this stuff because this is what happens when black men do not control the economic landscape of their own communities. They start redefining things to their benefit because they are operating WITHOUT US.

    Another issue is the fact that black men are not recognized as builders by black women and because we’re not legacy builders black women don’t see the reason why it matters whether a man is raising his own kids.

    If we were building then they would recognize what black men are accomplishing, and know what black men are spending their time focusing on; we don’t need any distractions or situtations that are going to pull resources away from what we would be building. They don’t see their value being associated with the building process because we are not building. Therefore a woman who has children by another man thinks it should be inconsequential outside the disadvantage that they see as minor, of taking care of someone elses children. I assuming her assumption is that she’s such the premier woman that getting with her is such a reward that you can, or should overlook the fact that she has children. This is why they come to us with kids because since we’re not building, what does it matter if they have children from a previous relationships or not. It’s not like we’re saving up our resources to actually do something productive with in or for the community. This dives right into one of the reasons why black women don’t really care what black men are doing because they don’t see or think we’re doing much, so her coming to us with a child should be of no consequence. It is ludicrous thinking, but I get it.

    Also the value of black women is low right now because of the fact that black men are not building and passing on legacies and creating communities that are trying to maintain and contain wealth which necessitates keeping the children black. Without men being established, HEADING their communities, (something many black women fight) and passing on wealth via the black woman, I don’t see black women being elevated much about other races of women. The men would have to be in control and BUILDING just like all other races of men in order for black women to be valued the same way as other races of women which is attached to building. Many women believe that black women should be valued off of some magical earth mother status. They are incorrect. A woman’s value in all societies is directly attached to what the men are building.

    So there’s the deep answer – that answers a lot of question.

  • QoNewC

    @Curly Sue

    Someone asked me why I would prefer my daughter play step parent than my son. I would hope that my son wasnt a sexual predator of children but the probability would be a lot higher with him than with my daughter. Im talking statisticallys speaking.

    Women have always taken in many other children. My grandmother did as she was leaving Haiti with her own children. She claimed children that werent hers to provide for them a better life. Women are far more likely to adopt than men are. Thankfully, I havent lost my nature as a woman to want to nurture a child…any child. Its something that I am proud of as a woman.

  • Keep it Real

    @Liz

    The only thing “the look” has gotten her up to this point is 3 kids by 3 different men. In the future, my suspicion is “the look” will only get her more of the same. Hopefully, she’s learned to take birth control consistently and correctly. Otherwise, you and others like you will be on a blog making excuses, celebrating and trying to shout down anyone who questions the wisdom of Baby daddy #4.

    What happened black folks….dysfunction was not always your culture. Love your people enough to speak the truth.

  • Perspective

    Also just so everyone knows – Taren Guy is biracial. One of her parents is white. I take a slight issue with some of the hypocrisy where Thandie Newton playing a Nigerian woman was an issue (which I agree it is) because she is not black, but Taren Guy gets to represent black women via something that isn’t the best situation – single motherhood.

    If we were having a beauty contest some of the very same women that have her back right now would be the first ones to be up in arms about this mixed woman representing black beauty.

    Just and observation. I’m bother by the inconsistencies of who represents what when. Biracial women are cool – even when they are representing the negative as long as they aren’t representing black beauty. Then it’s a problem.

    “Light skin B!”

  • Greg

    “How DARE YOU label people as damaged goods! You don’t know how these people came about their families”

    Yeah we DARE. Who the hell do you think you are YOU DREDGE? Apparently your lowered status in society has damaged your IQ.

    Other people we don’t know and speak on at Clutch include:

    Solange, Beyonce, Michael Nutter, Chris Brown, Estelle, Taren Guy, Missy Elliot, J Cole, Ashanti, Michelle Obama, Barack Obama, Angela Stanton, Phaeedra Parks,Wiz Khalifa, Drake, Sarah Billingsley-Walker, Kwame Kilpatrick, Nicki Minaj, Nina Turner, Cuba Gooding Jr., Nia Long,Larenz Tate, Cissy Houston, Gabrielle Union, etc, etc, etc.

    You horrible single mommas need better arguments. lol.

  • QoNewC

    @TJ

    ” Yes some women do choose to have children a parent alone, the same way that women choose to have abortions.”

    Sometimes I wish you guys would think about the fate of these children they either choose to have alone or abort. Its not all about your choices.

    “Parenthood and motherhood should not be seen as a consequence of come terrible choice one made.”

    Parenthood and motherhood arent mutually exclusive but there are some forms of both that are far superior. The reasons can be immense and measurable.

    “Societally this is a cultural stereotype that people continue to reinforce with their idiotic comments.”

    No, this isnt a stereotype. These are about the qauntifiable and qaulitative differences between the outcomes of children raise by a lone parent and children raised jointly.

    “Marriage is not the end all be all.”

    Marriage is like democracy- Its a terrible institution but its far better than the alternative.

    “A lot of women don’t choose to get a divorce, often times they are forced due to infidelity, domestic violence, pedophillia, financial mismanagement, etc.”

    Actually the most cited reasons for difference are financial not the above strawmen you have just offered up.

    “Women have children and can’t control their spouses no more than women who don’t have children and can’t control their spouses.”

    We are talking about single mothers who dont have spouses.

  • Afrostyling

    3 kids with 3 diff men? I’onno…

  • CurlySue

    Damn, is that her father:children ratio? I listened to that long-ass rambling video and I assumed that her two sons (11 and 12) had the same father and her 4 year old daughter had a different dad.

  • CurlySue

    See, I assumed from the video that her two sons (11 and 12) were to the same man and her 4 year old daughter was to a different man. Wow, was it three daddies?

  • Awalkinmyshoes

    @Greg
    You coward turning your reply off. Really? Yes I dare…..because there is ALWAYS an exception to the rule. So if in general we are ingorant and have low IQs and social status…..what does that make you? Well, if we are clumping everyone into a stereotype you’d be another black man bound for jail and living off your woman or sentenced to die a violent death before 30…sound like you Greg? Furthermore….I more than likely clock more than you like most single black women and that makes brothers mad….it’s ok you’ll get there.

    I also bet your mother would slap the taste out of your mouth for your comments alone because whether you have a man in the home or not being a parent is a thankless job. We give so much of ourselves you childless people would not even understand. So out of respect for your mother or women in general you really need to ease up. And I’m glad I’m a mother….when you are out there looking for someone to love your ashy trifling tail and bitter words. I got two angels that love me 24-7 365 not matter what…..you should be jealous.

  • Si On Da

    It is approaching afternoon in NYC, and I already have to pimpsmack a broad…

    @Yb You know what the f**k is up… stop playing dumb & acting that these women deserve the keys to the city

    @QNC Thanks again for being the female voice of reason… It is nice to know that some women get it What I’ve learned pretending to be a man

    @Donald K Summer Nobody wants to touch the fact that women make poor decisions in men… They just like to shame the people who keep bringing up an irrefutable point…

    I have no problem with what women are attracted to, but if it comes at the expense of girls & boys who need a functional, present father… That’s a problem

    @Liz & @TJ Have a seat… Most single mothers, are not widows, divorcees or victims of a violent rape…

    Stop muddling legitimate victims with women who made poor choices & don’t quality check the men they let in unprotected…

  • mamareese

    I was referring to the article at 1st and was not commenting on anyone else’s comments.

  • iQgraphics

    I don’t know about the spiel regarding women WANTING and DECIDING to become single mothers, but on all other fronts, @QON is right. A man that does not have kids is extremely pensive about raising another mans child. And that is natural. It’s self preservation.

  • CurlySue

    If all three of her children are by three different men, then I’m sorry. You’re trash. Period. There is NO reason that you have a 1:1 father/child ratio for three kids. The hell? And you weren’t married to nary a one of them? Sorry, but you can be as cute as you want and philosophize on street corners but the fact remains that you’re a moron who couldn’t figure out birth control after 1 or even 2 illegitimate kids. And do NOT give advice to single mothers like they all share your hoe-ish experience. One child? I can see that. THREE KIDS TO THREE MEN?! That’s some Maury Povich sh*t. Forget worrying about men taking you seriously. How do you take YOURSELF seriously? Just go back to wearing too much pink lipstick and mugging for the camera.

  • Yb

    “It is approaching afternoon in NYC, and I already have to pimpsmack a broad…

    You know what the f**k is up… stop playing dumb & acting that these women deserve the keys to the city”

    @si no da

    It boggles my mind, that from article to article, you constantly display to the women of Clutch that you are a sociopath, potential woman beater, and misogynist and yet still have the audisty to be mad and bitter when black women (and obviously women of other races as well) discard you for other men and will CONTINUE to do so.

    Reread my comment and stop manipulating words it what YOU want them to be. I said single mothers raising there children, WELL deserve respect just like any other parent child combo does.

    Just remember that bitching about women on the web will not make you any more attractive to women in real life.

  • iQgraphics

    @QCastle
    If your son is evolved enough to raise another man’s child and cultivate a family by any means, you should be proud and not judgmental.
    Lots of things happen in a womans life that lead to her being a single mother. If your son is evolved enough to listen to this womans life story, accept and love her, you should too.

    Stop acting like you have never been violated in your life. And if you have not, you are only about 25% of women.

    Be open minded and I do hope your children surpass your thinking

  • Shut up

    Unless these people are having children out of wedlock by IVF…then they are not “purposely” becoming single parents.

  • I call Bull

    Lmaooooo roasted!

  • iQgraphics

    yeah man, that sh!t is wild!
    and that’s coming from a SINGLE MOTHER!

  • mamareese

    people with children should be getting with people with chidren……

    How about this…..you should get with who you want or who you love and that your business.

    And to my knowledge NO ONE promotes single motherhood….I cant think of one woman that plans for this to happen. Sometimes that is just how the cookie crumbles….What has me so bent out of shape is because if you don’t know me you are left up to your assumptions. Aw she got 2 kids aw she must be in the system aw my tax money aw them kids look like they got different daddies. So ignorant people clump the divorced, widowed mothers etc all into one group. For all you know a woman could be a single mother because it was the only way she could save her childs life!!!! But once we share it with you its like aw well that’s different. You shouldn’t feel this way in the 1st place if a woman is doing what she has to do to raise her family and stay out of your pockets. I’m just staying a struggle to overstand why folks just cant leave people to their own lives. Focus on making yourself a better person rather than all this negative or something so wonderful and positive as children. This whole topic just shows how ugly people’s hearts really are…no directed towards you Niki just in general.

  • au napptural

    I’m surprised at you. I’m hoping somebody stole your sign-in. Normally you have something intelligent and insightful to add, but that mess sounds like QON or somebody.

    Presumably, those men laid down with her without protection- where’s their ridicule? You said she wasn’t married to any of those dudes- so it would be better if she had married and divorced 3 times? Marriage doesn’t solidify a bad situation and it damn sure won’t make a deadbeat take responsibility. You know many divorced women are fighting for child support? How many married and separated women can’t get their husbands to be involved with the child(ren)? Marriage isn’t some silver bullet- it won’t cure everything. Marriage to the right person is wonderful, but marriage to the wrong person is untenable.That whole argument was some patriarchal crap. Basically, you are saying she isn’t worth anything because of her sexual history. Shame on you.

    Black women are already under attack, I don’t see why other black women have to add to it. See has some less than desirable circumstances- And? The children are here now. Instead of tearing their mother down people need to be trying to raise up this generation of children as a whole.

  • CurlySue

    I’m sorry for being so curt like that, but Jesus! I try to be pretty balanced in most of my commenting but I HATE people who try to intellectualize, rationalize, or philosophize their horrid life decisions. Let’s be honest here, if she was in the video with a bad weave and a wicked neck roll, we’d write her off as just another bird. But because she can string sentences together and doesn’t look like she smells like cheetos left in the rain, we’re glossing over a major factoid here. It’s not that she’s a single mother. If she was a divorced single mother of three, I wouldn’t bat an eye. But THREE kids by THREE men? That’s completely unacceptable and it angers me that she’s trying to give advice. You have zero room to sit there like some sage old oracle of wisdom especially considering that you had your last child only 4 years ago. Just full stop, please.

  • CurlySue

    @ Au naptural : please see my post right below yours. You’re right, a post like that isn’t my SOP, but that’s how FIGHTING mad people like this make me. Again, a divorced mother of three struggling along is something I sympathize with and would defend endlessly. But a woman who chose to have risky sex with three different men is a wildly inappropriate voice for the single woman community. It trivializes the real struggles that divorced/separate single mothers go through. Her being all like “Well you can trust and believe I could get a man but I don’t need one!” is a smack in the face to all those women out there who had children with husbands and never ever wanted to be without those men. And it makes me mad. So, again, I’m sorry for being so blunt like that, but her flippant attitude pissed me off.

  • CurlySue

    Also, “Black women are already under attack, I don’t see why other black women have to add to it.”

    I don’t want to give anyone a false impression here. I’m not a black woman. I responded to this article as a woman, as the title was race-neutral. so, that’s out of the way.

    My mother was a divorced mother of two (before she met my father and her husband of 30 years) and she struggled every day. My father married her and became more of a father to my older sister than her bio dad ever was. So, I have a huge respect for men who choose to love and raise children that aren’t his own. And that experience is partly what makes me angry when women trivialize the issue or anoint themselves as the mouthpiece of a cause when their circumstances were a result of irresponsibility.

  • mamareese

    Has anyone confirmed that this even is true? Would seem very harsh if it’s not…..Folks are really going off on an assumptions……And if it is ya’ll love the snot out of Erykah Badu and she’s confirmed to have 3 baby fathers….just saying.

  • iQgraphics

    @curly
    What are you apologizing for?

    After my first kid, I was like “this sh!t is hard”

    Nothing wrong with the kid, just life in general.

    Everyone has their circumstances, their journey etc.

    This Taren woman is confused. around the 8 minute mark, she sounds as if she is trying to convince herself of the things she says.

    Then she says, “being single and appreciating that I don’t need another person to fulfill me emotionally makes me want a relationship more”… then she says ” if I wanted to be in a relationship, I would be in one”

    That girl right there is all the way messy. ALL THE WAY.

    She is co-dependent. ALL THE WAY.

  • minna k.

    I can’t even believe all of the judgement spewed all over this thread, let alone the need to question if a human being could be damaged goods for having children. all of this rhetoric, and need to be correct (and oh so distant from any dysfunction, god forbid) is nothing but spillover from Regan era demonization politics based on shame and guilt, black folks being the ones to internalize it the most. It’s not original, and it has not helped us to advance as a people.

    “Damaged goods”, is also telling of the idea that women are still seen as objects or potential property, (trophies, arm candy) and a reflection of a man’s sensibilities and personal values. Not her own person with her own life path and experiences. I’m really not into it.

  • au napptural

    @Curly You have some valid points. I get disgusted with “repeat offenders” myself. But at the same time, some things are just bad thinking, period. If it’s patriarchal and sexist to judge her sexual history and make VALUE statements about her worth with no kids or one kid, it’s the same with three. Yes, this situation is messy. But her worth as a human being is (or should be) built more on how intelligent she is and what her interests are than on what she has been doing in the bedroom and with whom.

    Side note-Where is the chastisement for lil wayne and his ilk. That negro has a ton of children, all out of wedlock…Waiting for the responses of “that’s different” and “it’s the woman’s responsibility” in 5…4…3…

  • au napptural

    Thank you for having good sense and trying to share with the class.

  • CurlySue

    @au napptural: Yes, I 100% agree that it is unfair that women bear the brunt of the chastisement for having OOW children. And believe me, I’m just as critical of men like Lil Wayne (who is nasty from those crusty dreds to his, I’m sure, scaly feet). But since the video was posted by a woman, I responded to the situation accordingly. And although I do see what you’re saying when it comes to determining a person’s worth on their habits, hobbies, etc, I think it’s almost impossible to separate how they’re viewed from their actions. And having three children by three men, two of them within a year of each other, just reeks of irresponsibility. And I’m not even saying people don’t make mistakes when they’re younger, but three times? That seems so excessive.

  • iQgraphics

    I don’t think women with kids (plural, singular or en uteruo) are damaged goods. I think everyone has their own process and journey.

    Opinions are like as$h0les. Ms Taren needs thicker skin and probably could benefit from some therapy.

    I also think hindsight is about as useful as having eyes in your as$, but if you have the benefit to take advantage of hindsight, which is a rarity and a gift, and you don’t then I don’t know what to tell you.

    Live your life.

  • OSHH

    I hate the term “damaged goods” also for the reasons highlighted but also because everyone has a past, and no one gets through life without having acquired some sort of baggage from the past.
    The good thing about that is you can have a bag check from time to time unpack lighten the load by taking inventory, self relfection, making peace, offering forgivenss etc as you go through life, What was meant or seen by some as damage can also be the very thing that blesses you further down the line. How you see yourself is so vital though as we are all imperfect works in progress, striving to live learn and do better.

  • Perspective

    @ mamareese

    Your comment is foolish and doesn’t address anything. The bottom line is that women who find themselves in a bad situation are trying to redefine the value of a women with children to childless men.

    As I have stated, with men who have children there is no argument.

    No one is judging single mothers or WHAT THEY DO or DON’T DO with their kids or the man who ACCEPTS what they have going on.

    The problem is the minute that women with children try to SHAME! those who do not want to deal into dealing with them and their children with someone else.

    Forget all the feel good stuff. None of this should even be an issue because women should only be having children within the confines of marriage.

    I am sick and tired of people trying to readjust from the way it should be. I’m sick and tired of those who find themselves jammed up in bad situations due to either

    bad choices
    lack of self control
    lack of self discipline

    CRYING – because someone else doesn’t want to deal with their issues or circumstances.

    If a man says – I don’t deal with single mothers – THAT’S IT. End of story. There’s no rebuttal. He doesn’t want to deal. Move on. Stop trying to sell yourself to him. Go talk to the guy with children.

    Its frustrating why there are so many women who do not get this. Do you, just stop trying to bring the BAR OR STANDARDS way down, so that you fit into the acceptability box.

    Single motherhood should not be acceptable unless the women is divorce (which means she at least TRIED) to do it the right way, I’ll at least give them that, or her man died.

    Outside of that, when it comes to just these BABY MOMMAS – pleasssssse don’t come around me because you are going to get one hell of a tongue lashing if you are trying to sell me the idea that you are just as valuable as a childless woman. Mind your business and I will mind mine, but if I see you trying to climb up on the pedestal of VALUED WOMEN. I’m gonna snatch your butt right down. You should have thought about that before you laid up with MR. WRONG WITH NO PROTECTION.

  • Greg

    Wait, wait, wait..,
    So your asking us to be PATRIARCHAL in criticizing lil Wayne or MATRIARCHAL in criticizing Lil Wayne?!?

    “Marriage to the right person is wonderful, but marriage to the wrong person is untenable.That whole argument was some PATRIARCHAL crap. Basically, you are saying she isn’t worth anything because of her sexual history. Shame on you.”

    ” it’s PATRIARCHAL and sexist to judge her sexual history and make VALUE statements about her worth with no kids or one kid, it’s the same with three. ”

    “”Side note-Where is the chastisement for lil wayne and his ilk. That negro has a ton of children, all out of wedlock…Waiting for the responses of “that’s different” and “it’s the woman’s responsibility” in 5…4…3…””

  • Si On Da

    - Yes, Single Mothers are damaged goods… Next question…

    - Single Moms are great for F*CKING & $UCK*NG… Even a 3 month fling… But that is where it ends… There are men out there who will put a ring on it… (Hapless beta males who probably was raised by a single mother)… Next question…

    - Two Parent Homes > Single fathers > single mothers… S/M create sl*tty/masculinized/uncouth women & simpish/Criminalistic/Terroristic men… Next que.stion…

    - America is slowly but surely realized the danger that single motherhood poses to this country… Now that S/M is increasing in middle class White America… I don’t want to live in any city where single motherhood is rampant… Next questi.on…

    If you are a divorcee or widow or a victim of the “R” word & kept the baby, you are a legit victim, and you have indefinite protected status… Next questio.n..

    I know alot of women frivolously divorce these days, but that is a step up from never married baby mothers…

    Cl-tch, bring back the 400+ comment IR articles… :-)

    Fin

  • http://theinfamoustronise.blogspot.com T. Ronise

    Maybe I missed it, but when did she say her children all had different fathers? Either way so what? She made mistakes, but does that take away from her being a good mother to her children? Don’t be so judgemental. My two brothers and I have different fathers. My mother was married once. She remarried when I was 15 to an awesome guy (with no children), who loves us like we are his own. They will celebrate their 14th anniversary this year. I am not a single mother nor am I a parent, but I do respect others and their choices because at the end of the day it doesn’t affect me.

  • au napptural

    One more comment- I’ve watched the WHOLE video now and she says some great things. The high points-she says yes, w/e you did to get to your single parenthood you made your bed and you have to lie in it. Yes, sometimes it isn’t your fault, divorce and all- but people are still going to talk about you, so have confidence. Believe in yourself, believe you are worthwhile. She said she DOES NOT advocate having OOW children or teen pregnancy, she wants people to get married and do things in the right order. But for the people who are already in the situation, she is encouraging them to not give up hope and to be strong.

    I just don’t understand the hidden “negative” messages people are seeing. They must be projecting onto this woman, b/c I don’t see it.

  • Greg

    P.S. au napptural:

    Will it be PATRIARCHAL or MATRIARCHAL when parents criticize their childrens sexual habits?

    Will it be PATRIARCHAL or MATRIARCHAL when siblings criticize their siblings sexual habits?

    Will it be PATRIARCHAL or MATRIARCHAL when children criticize their parents sexual habits?

    From what I’m seeing women will do anything in their power to avoid ANY criticism while simultaneously blaming men for what they themselves, their mates, their siblings and their own children do everyday.

    ..and with their being so few men around this partiarchal oppression meme is just not adding up.

    Feminist have lost their damn minds!!!!!
    LOL.

  • Greg

    P.S. au napptural:

    Will it be PATRIARCHAL or MATRIARCHAL when parents criticize their childrens sexual habits?

    Will it be PATRIARCHAL or MATRIARCHAL when siblings criticize their siblings sexual habits?

    Will it be PATRIARCHAL or MATRIARCHAL when children criticize their parents sexual habits?

    From what I’m seeing women will do anything in their power to avoid ANY criticism while simultaneously blaming men for what they themselves, their mates, their siblings and their own children do everyday.

    ..and with their being so few men around this partiarchal oppression meme is just not adding up.

    Feminist have lost their damn minds!!!
    LOL.

  • Isis

    Preach keep it real preach. Couldnt have said it better myself

  • Greg

    and T. Ronise:

    We can be judgemental all we want. Why should we suspend such a natural act when it comes to single mothers.

    Are single mothers not judgemental of their mates? Their children. Parents?

    Such silly logic on this site at times. How do you people manage your own lives w/o value calls on employers, mates, friends, strangers, pets, plants…

    Goodness!!!

  • Greg

    and T. Ronise:

    We can be judgemental all we want. Why should we suspend such a natural act when it comes to single mothers.

    Are single mothers not judgemental of their mates? Their children. Parents?

    Such silly logic on this site at times. How do you people manage your own lives w/o value calls on employers, mates, friends, strangers, pets, plants…

    Goodness!!!

  • http://theinfamoustronise.blogspot.com T. Ronise

    Yeah you can be judgemental all you want and I didn’t mean it just for single mothers. I meant in general. No one’s perfect, and if calling out people for their mistakes is all you do with your life do you. I don’t judge and I don’t tolerate being judged. Good day.

  • Greg

    Then it’s kinds silly to be on Clutch or ANY MEDIA regarding another person isn’t it?

    We judge all manner of things in life generally or specifically. They very act of telling someone NOT to judge is a judgement. Deal with it.

    The mental gymnastics involved in protecting single mothers has been well beyond ridiculous for some time now.

  • Keep it Real

    @minna k.
    nothing but spillover from Regan era demonization politics based on shame and guilt, black folks being the ones to internalize it the most. It’s not original, and it has not helped us to advance as a people.
    ________________________________________

    Lies, lies, lies…. lol. You’ve been brainwashed. We know for a fact illegitimacy was stigmatized and overwhelmingly rejected in the black community pre 1960′s. As it is in all other cultures and races throughout the world including Africa. And are you saying illegitimacy has been beneficial to the black community? Question, how has it been beneficial to the COMMUNITY?

  • TruthHurts

    The breakdown of the Black family is leading to this type of dysfunction being seen as acceptable. There is nothing positive about getting knocked up unmarried (This statement does not include those who were raped.) Who you choose as the parent of your baby and who you lay down with says a lot about you! Don’t get knocked up until you’re married. No greater love than your own, there is nothing positive about being a bastard having baby momma or bastard having baby daddy!

    P. S. and we make up close to half of all AIDS cases….that’s enough to practice caution.

  • TruthHurts

    It’s psychologically damaging to a child to have different people come in and out of their lives. Children need stability.

  • Keep it Real

    @minna k.

    is nothing but spillover from Regan era demonization politics based on shame and guilt, black folks being the ones to internalize it the most. It’s not original, and it has not helped us to advance as a people
    ________________________________________

    Yeah, Not a Regan fan but do you see what liberals and feminist have done? It’s brainwashing. smh Illegitimacy was stigmatized and overwhelmingly rejected in the black community pre 1960′s (from 1900 to 1960 illegitimacy was between 10 to 24%). These liberals and feminist reject the traditional nuclear family and are pushing their Alternative or New Familial Structure. 2 men, 2 women, Single mother… everything goes. They have black women and emasculated men thinking that illegitimacy and dysfunction has always been black culture,wrong! I wouldn’t care but we now know after 3 to 4 generations that IT DOES NOT WORK! At least not in the black community.

    In the 60′s, black women were initially hostile to feminist and this new way of raising families. Paying poor black women who didn’t have a man in the home for irresponsible behavior (every kid she had) changed that ie through welfare. She no longer needed the poor black man to put a roof over her head, food on the table for her and the kids and clothes on their back. Hell, she even had a couple of bucks leftover for smokes. Black women throw up this well black women are (better now) going to college. But the truth is only 18% of black women graduate from college. What about the other 82% of black women? After all, these are the women who are having the majority of kids. To put the poor black woman’s situation into perspective. Let’s look Shamkia on welfare three kids by three different men with no man in the home living in a community with the majority of other homes headed by young poor black single baby mammas with no men in the home. And, Martha Louise, (her great grandmother) poor with 5 kids but married. All the kids raised by Martha and Joe, her husband, whom she married at 19 living in a community with the majority of other homes headed by poor but married black families. Which community was dysfunctional? Which kids lived in a better situation with the best chance to be productive?

  • Kir12 aka KeepitReal

    @minna k.

    is nothing but spillover from Regan era demonization politics based on shame and guilt, black folks being the ones to internalize it the most. It’s not original, and it has not helped us to advance as a people
    ________________________________________

    Yeah, Not a Regan fan but do you see what liberals and feminist have done? It’s brainwashing. smh Illegitimacy was stigmatized and overwhelmingly rejected in the black community pre 1960′s (from 1900 to 1960 illegitimacy was between 10 to 24%). These liberals and feminist reject the traditional nuclear family and are pushing their Alternative or New Familial Structure. 2 men, 2 women, Single mother… everything goes. They have black women and emasculated men thinking that illegitimacy and dysfunction has always been black culture,wrong! I wouldn’t care but we now know after 3 to 4 generations that IT DOES NOT WORK! At least not in the black community.

    In the 60′s, black women were initially hostile to feminist and this new way of raising families. Paying poor black women who didn’t have a man in the home for irresponsible behavior (every kid she had) changed that ie through welfare. She no longer needed the poor black man to put a roof over her head, food on the table for her and the kids and clothes on their back. Hell, she even had a couple of bucks leftover for smokes. Black women throw up this well black women are (better now) going to college. But the truth is only 18% of black women graduate from college. What about the other 82% of black women? After all, these are the women who are having the majority of kids. To put the poor black woman’s situation into perspective. Let’s look Shamkia on welfare three kids by three different men with no man in the home living in a community with the majority of other homes headed by young poor black single baby mammas with no men in the home. And, Martha Louise, (her great grandmother) poor with 5 kids but married. All the kids raised by Martha and Joe, her husband, whom she married at 19 living in a community with the majority of other homes headed by poor but married black families. Which community was dysfunctional? Which kids lived in a better situation with the best chance to be productive?

  • Are You Serious Bro

    Reading Clutch you would think the US was a full blown Caste System where single mothers are the Untouchables along with the crack heads and homeless. Someone mentioned beating a dead horse, I say it’s more like gnawing at decaying bones at this point.

    I wouldn’t date a single mother for a variety reasons, but the constant beat down they receive on the internet is ridiculous. For those that are truly worried about the plight of single mothers and their effect on the black community, how about you:

    1. Volunteer at shelters for single mothers
    2. Inform the youth and those around you about contraceptive and its benefits
    3. Better yet talk to your congressmen and women about supporting a bill that will allow contraceptives and birth control to be included and covered on employees insurance and to increase birth control access to the poor.

    Whatever you do it would be much more beneficial to the “community” then what you did here.

  • Keep it Real

    test

  • Pattie

    I know her and her family personally! Doesn’t have custody of two of her Autistic children. She would go party and leave them in the house. When the authorities came the children opened the door happily. Now the sister of the father of those child have full custody! This chick really needs to cut it out!!!! She is ALWAYS in the STREETS!!! She is always in the clubs picking up men & women. Feeling them up in corners, child please! She is not telling you everything (not expecting her too)! I have two girls and I am with a very smart, supportive, loving, respectful, charming, attentive man. The problem with this chick is she is one way on videos and another way behind closed doors.

  • Greg

    Then it’s kinds silly to be on Clutch or ANY MEDIA regarding another person isn’t it?

    We judge all manner of things in life generally or specifically. They very act of telling someone NOT to judge is a judgement. Deal w/it.

    The mental gymnastics involved in protecting single mothers has been well beyond ridiculous for some time now.

  • Jewelle

    I know her and her family personally! Doesn’t have custody of two of her Autistic children. She would go party and leave them in the house. When the authorities came the children opened the door happily. Now the sister of the father of those child have full custody! This chick really needs to cut it out!!!! She is ALWAYS in the STREETS!!! She is always in the clubs picking up men & women. Feeling them up in corners, child please! She is not telling you everything (not expecting her too)! I have two girls and I am with a very smart, supportive, loving, respectful, charming, attentive man. The problem with this chick is she is one way on videos and another way behind closed doors.

  • Liz

    @Si On Da..you have a seat f*cktard. Like I said, you judging folks all willy nilly without knowing their story is foolish. I hope you’re own story is judged as harshly as you judge others.

  • CurlySue

    IF that’s true than I feel justified in making every one of my statements even more than I did before. Of course, if it’s not true than you’re a weirdo lol.

  • Greg

    “1. Volunteer at shelters for single mothers”

    -HELL NO. Aiding them would give them an excuse to have more OOW children and encourage others to follow their lead.

    “2. Inform the youth and those around you about contraceptive and its benefits”

    -That’s been going on the last 2-3 decades. It’s not helping at all.

    “3. Better yet talk to your congressmen and women about supporting a bill that will allow contraceptives and birth control to be included and covered on employees insurance and to increase birth control access to the poor.”

    -See 1.
    Only encourages them to work less hard to cover the expense of their own sexual activities (See 2.) Why have me and the tax-payers pay for things we would rather discourage. I’d rather offer financial/tax incentives to two-parent households by stripping/switching ALL of those currently proffered to single mother households, the current bane of the black community.

    “For those that are truly worried about the plight of single mothers and their effect on the black community, how about you:”

    STOP OFFERING THEM INCENTIVES!

  • Alexandra

    I watched this video and commented already and no I don’t agree that single mothers are damaged goods.

    Aside from her own situation, I do think some people need to understand that all single-mothers don’t have the same story. When I see or hear about a single mom, I admit that I’m already making judgements. And of course I do the same when I hear about Black single moms, especially one trying give me advice. However, the stereotypical reckless behavior some are known for are not the main reasons behind their current problem. No where do I think she was praising single mothers or encouraging that. Everyone should defend themselves and I can’t imagine raising a child alone. When racial perception is added into the convo, the discussions become even more hateful. Every single mother is not the same.

    I will mention that it is predicable to see the same story over and over. I don’t believe marriage is the end all but I do believe that it showed strong commitment to create a family at one point; even more if the child(ren) came after. There are just too many children being born out of wedlock and it’s being done up to 3+ men/children now. Everyone’s situation is different but its hard not to judge and see the mistakes she made. That’s all I think she was trying to say. I also have to admit that single mothers that are also divorcee’s & widows are always going to be seen as more responsible (and may even be respected more), regardless of their outcomes.

    They are not damaged goods and she’s human like everyone else. In my opinion, her being unmarried with kids will only be seen as a handicap on the dating market.

  • Perspective

    “I just don’t understand the hidden “negative” messages people are seeing. They must be projecting onto this woman, b/c I don’t see it.”

    Although – I can understand and appreciate how you view it the issue is the fact that there

    ISN’T ENOUGH SHAME in the black community when it comes to these things.

    THAT IS A PROBLEM

    without shame how do u deter deviant behavior?

    In other communities women are shunned, women are stoned, honor killed – and obviously I don’t condone that, but u have to admit that when black people go out and do the same thing what is said.

    “OH THAT’S JUST MY BABY DADDY.”

    Go find me an East Indian girl who can go back to her community pregnant and say – “Oh papa, that’s just my baby daddy.”

    Or an Arab girl, Asian girl, or affluent white girl. That type of stuff just does not fly.

    Our communities issue is really the poverty and the lack of resources in the community, which goes back to what black men are not creating, and this reversed matriarchal structure that has been entrenched in the black community for far too long and then we wonder why we have so many weak men out here that do not understand their role as men and their responsibilities.

    I’m not going to tell me to go out here and do things for their community above and beyond the scope of women simply because WE ARE MEN AND HAVE TO MAN UP, without them have central control over what they create.

    Without men like this in the community and them having a purpose and reward behind what they do, the type of men who exist and impregnate women will continue to exist in the community.

    I see many women who don’t value upstanding men which is why they don’t think it matters who they get with nor why it should matter if they come to an upstanding man with children because they don’t value what that man is doing because they don’t think he’s really doing much, and the truth is he isn’t.

    A lot of things have to change, but the truth is if we are going to create standards in the community, there has to be punishment that goes along with that.

    You can’t have rule with no punishment and you can’t half ass drawing the line in the sand.

    You can’t uplift single mothers and say, don’t worry the babies here, it’s ok. Be seen doing that – then turn around and tell all the other girls how important it is for them to get married first before having children.

    It simply cannot be done. That’s like smoking in front of a child and then telling them all the reasons they shouldn’t smoke.

    Yea good luck with that one.

    I see too many people with C’s trying to make a C the new A.

  • sli

    Who are we to call anybody “damaged goods.” How disgusting are you people?

  • Perspective

    If anyone cares to know this is the problem with praise or uplifting of single mothers.

    There is only PRAISE AND UPLIFTING. We are not allowed to criticize those that aren’t doing such a great job because the black community doesn’t believe in shame.

    If single mothered families were the way to go then why does the black community look the way that it does.

    We love to focus on the 25% of those single mothers who are doing a great job, but we never want to address or criticize the 75% who are doing NOT SO GREAT OF A JOB. Then we give them excuses and blame it on the man when 5 minutes ago they were bragging about how they could do it all by themselves.

    Its either hard, or you can do it all by yourself – you can’t have it both ways.

    Either you take the praise when the children do well underneath the rearing of a single mother and at the same time we criticize those that aren’t doing a great job

    (We should have some parity)

    But what we should not being doing is only praising the 25% who are doing a great job but say nothing of all those that aren’t.

    Most men in prison came from single parent homes. FACT!

    Why is it the single moms can stand their and collect their medals when the children do well (ALL PRAISE BE TO HER)

    But when they children fail – (ITS CAUSE HIS DADDY WASN’T THERE)

    Talk about UNACCOUNTABILITY.

    You can be there for the praise, but not the criticism? Come on now?!

    All this should be thought about before brining a child into the world as a single mother. There is no excuse no-a-days, we got condoms, the pill, the morning after (Plan B)

    I mean damn.

    then we I enter a room full of women who are single mothers I get – don’t talk about me, at least I’m here. Whoa lady, you don’t get medals because of biology and the child comes out of your womb.

    The problem is because we only like to praise the 25% and ignore the 75% who aren’t so great – what it looks like is that 100% – (the 25% that we’re only seeing) are doing SOOOO GREAT!

    Yes the 25% are doing great but it doesn’t speak to the vast majority, and we can’t have it where women can take praise and accolades but they can’t take the heat.

  • Greg

    We prefer the term DBR single mothers.
    Thank You.

  • Liz

    The only thing “the look” has gotten her up to this point is 3 kids by 3 different men. In the future, my suspicion is “the look” will only get her more of the same. Hopefully, she’s learned to take birth control consistently and correctly. Otherwise, you and others like you will be on a blog making excuses, celebrating and trying to shout down anyone who questions the wisdom of Baby daddy #4.

    What happened black folks….dysfunction was not always your culture. Love your people enough to speak the truth

    -Honey, I’m making excuses for no one and I didn’t shout anyone down either. I’m not a single mother, don’t plan on becoming one, and I don’t condone women making the CHOICE to become mothers before they become wives. I just don’t judge people and maybe I’m a bit of a bleeding heart. My comment stems from an unofficial poll I conducted with the men around me, who all agreed Taren was gorgeous. Men make exceptions for beautiful women. She’s got a shitload of kids…but she’s great armcandy.

  • KeepItStraightNoChaser

    I would just like to agree with some of the posts that I have seen concerning the topic. While I do not believe that single mothers are damaged goods because that is not for me to determine, I do believe that we as a society have gotten too relaxed and we think any and everything is acceptable and throw morals out the window. It’s one thing to be in a committed relationship/marriage and become a single mother because stuff happens, but it is quite another to be an irresponsible adult who has kids like cats and keep doing it and have no clue how you are going to provide for them.

    Just because something is common in society we automatically assume it’s acceptable and moral. This has happened with gay marriage, homosexuality, serial single mothers, deadbeat dads, and infidelity.

    Some of you are not going to like what I have to say. That’s fine. Just use spell check and say what you have to say without profanity or personally attacking me. You have no idea who I am. It is because everyone wants to be so tolerant and politically correct that no one is willing to be real and say what needs to be said. If I don’t agree I should be able to say so. This is supposed to be America. It’s now glamorous to be a single mother and people like myself who are waiting on that husband to start a family are seen as weirdos. SMH

  • KeepItStraightNoChaser

    I agree with what you said, especially the part about the absence of shame in the black community. We go to churches where we know the pastor has cheated on his wife and has kids out of wedlock, throw baby showers for 12 year olds, and physically threaten anyone who dare says they should be ashamed for bringing a baby into those circumstances. No one wants the truth, everyone wants to be accepted and do any and everything and its supposed to be ok. Until we stop being so accepting of these behaviors and stop glorifying them we will never do any better because everyone assumes its normal and they have nothing to be ashamed of because there are so many other single mothers.

  • Best Guest

    As a BW, I wouldn’t touch a man with a 10 foot pole that has children, so I can see and agree with men that don’t want to date women with children.

  • Nicole

    Im going to have to cosign with you!

  • Presh7Hill

    “Go find me an East Indian girl who can go back to her community pregnant and say – “Oh papa, that’s just my baby daddy.”

    Or an Arab girl, Asian girl, or affluent white girl. That type of stuff just does not fly.”
    __________

    I don’t know about an Arab or Asian girl, but an affluent white girl and her family can make just about ANY problem go away. She might get pregnant at 15, but her family will find a way to take care of it, even if it means she’s on “holiday” for 9 months or “studying abroad” or “visiting family in France” or they just pay for her abortion.

    Money and affluence change things. I think if young black people had the economic resources to both be involved in positive ventures AND be able to clean up messes if they happen, things would be different.

    Also, the standards applied to Arab relationships (arranged marriage, subservience of women, abuse of women) are not standards I would want to apply in my life.

    But I agree with you on the lack of shame in the black community. I also think it exists in the lower classes of the white and Latino community as well.

  • Presh7Hill

    +1

    Just wanted to add – I feel you on waiting for the right man to marry and build a family with. I see all my white friends doing this and am incredibly jealous. Few (really only 2) of my black girlfriends are married. Where I am now is I WANT a baby. My biological clock is ticking. But I still believe that family looks like a husband, wife, and kids. That just may not happen for me.

    So if I choose to have/adopt a child I will be a single mother. But I believe making a conscious decision to have a child and preparing for that (as an educated, financially stable, responsible, mature adult) is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT than being a single mother that just had a crazy summer and turn up preggers. And then it happened the summer after that…and the year after that.

  • Greg

    “But I believe making a conscious decision to have a child and preparing for that (as an educated, financially stable, responsible, mature adult) is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT than being a single mother that just had a crazy summer and turn up preggers. ”

    And THAT”S the problem. It’s not different at all. It’s still a horrible thing to do to a child.

  • Si On Da

    @Jewelle

    Thanks for the insider

  • Donald K Sumner

    Widows and divorcees OF COURSE are not counted among the damaged goods, THAT SH** IS IMPLIED!!!

  • Donald K Sumner

    @Si On Da,

    “Nobody wants to touch the fact that women make poor decisions in men… They just like to shame the people who keep bringing up an irrefutable point…”

    This++, so f***ing much this…

  • Donald K Sumner

    @Keep It Real,

    “The only thing “the look” has gotten her up to this point is 3 kids by 3 different men. In the future, my suspicion is “the look” will only get her more of the same. Hopefully, she’s learned to take birth control consistently and correctly. Otherwise, you and others like you will be on a blog making excuses, celebrating and trying to shout down anyone who questions the wisdom of Baby daddy #4.

    What happened black folks….dysfunction was not always your culture. Love your people enough to speak the truth.”

    Please Tell it!™

  • Donald K Sumner

    Great comment.

    But I will add that black will date/marry/f***/have kids with black men who do not have it together who are athlete/TALL/thug/gangster/bad boy/swag boy/player/baller/etc!

  • Donald K Sumner

    another great comment!

  • Donald K Sumner

    “Let’s be honest here, if she was in the video with a bad weave and a wicked neck roll, we’d write her off as just another bird. But because she can string sentences together and doesn’t look like she smells like cheetos left in the rain, we’re glossing over a major factoid here. It’s not that she’s a single mother. If she was a divorced single mother of three, I wouldn’t bat an eye. But THREE kids by THREE men? That’s completely unacceptable and it angers me that she’s trying to give advice.”

    +1000!

  • Si On Da

    @YB

    It boggles my mind, that from article to article, you constantly display to the women of Clu-tch that you are a sociopath, potential woman beater, and misogynist and yet still have the audisty to be mad and bitter when black women (and obviously women of other races as well) discard you for other men and will CONTINUE to do so.

    It boggles the mind when great almost irrefutable points are made, women like yourself, & man-ginas can sidestep them and focus on messager & not the message…

    My dating life is fine & will continue to improve… Unlike the single mothers you love to defend, I have standards, and make sure that I make a child, s/he will be well taken care of & have a functional mother & father to see to it that s/he is successful…

  • Donald K Sumner

    @Keep It Real – “Lies, lies, lies…. lol. You’ve been brainwashed. We know for a fact illegitimacy was stigmatized and overwhelmingly rejected in the black community pre 1960′s. As it is in all other cultures and races throughout the world including Africa. And are you saying illegitimacy has been beneficial to the black community? Question, how has it been beneficial to the COMMUNITY?”

    Everytime I bring up the point of illegitimacy being extremely low and STIGMATIZED in the black community PRE 1960s, I get SILENCE, especially from black women…

  • Si On Da

    @YB

    Reread my comment and stop manipulating words it what YOU want them to be. I said single mothers raising there children, WELL deserve respect just like any other parent child combo does.

    I heard you loud & clear, I even highlighted your words in BOLD…

    - Widows deserve respect (granted they didn’t have a hand in there husband’s murder)
    - Divorcees deserve respect (at least they signed a formal committment before the husband abandoned her)
    - S*xual assault victims deserve all the love & kindness the good world can offer to them

    You are giving respect to women who did not do a QUALITY check or make the father of their child sign a marriage license to her before they made that child… FOOH… You are smoking some high quality crack… And inadvertently condoning RAT-CHET behavior

  • Donald K Sumner

    It should ALSO BE NOTED that the majority of black Americans are working class/lower middle class…

  • Si On Da

    @Liz

    @Si On Da..you have a seat f*cktard. Like I said, you judging folks all willy nilly without knowing their story is foolish. I hope you’re own story is judged as harshly as you judge others.

    Wise Judgment is the oil that lubricates a functioning society… I promise you do not want to live in a place where there is total anarchy…

  • Donald K Sumner

    Here is something interesting:

  • Donald K Sumner

    @Greg – “Then it’s kinds silly to be on Clutch or ANY MEDIA regarding another person isn’t it?

    We judge all manner of things in life generally or specifically. They very act of telling someone NOT to judge is a judgement. Deal w/it.

    The mental gymnastics involved in protecting single mothers has been well beyond ridiculous for some time now.”

    Yeah, like how sistas judge short brothers.

  • Donald K Sumner

    @Greg,

    Great suggestion!

  • Donald K Sumner

    This sounds about right Pattie…

  • Greg

    TIME OUT.

    You can cut your reply OFF?!?

    can someone verify this?
    Re: the rest

    “We give so much of ourselves you childless people would not even understand.”

    Well WE give so much of OUR $$$ and I’m tired of you broke @sses and your pilfering and defense of the activity. The track record of YOU single mothers speaks volumes. Damn the exceptions!

    Your disgusting and a blight on the black community.

  • Presh7Hill

    When a person has sex on purpose, they are opening up the option of getting pregnant on purpose. Pregnancy isn’t an accident. Unless your tubes are tied or he’s had a vasectomy, sex can and will lead to pregnancy.

    Now if you aren’t responsible enough to know this, don’t use condoms/birth control, don’t practice abstinence, then are are basically saying with each and every sexual encounter that you want to get pregnant (or an STD).

    I’m tired of people claiming this “pregnant on accident” sh*t. Unless you are living under a rock, you know sex leads to pregnancy. You didn’t get pregnant on accident – you got pregnant on STUPID.

  • Greg

    “You didn’t get pregnant on accident – you got pregnant on STUPID.”

    LOL.
    Oh I’m stealing that one!!!

  • Presh7Hill

    “We give so much of ourselves you childless people would not even understand.”

    No one held a gun to your head and forced you to get married and have kids. Sorry you got a divorce, but this is America – the divorce rate is over 50% now. So you run the risk I guess? Your choices – your problems.

    And you are SO WRONG about childless people not having to give of themselves. The taxes I pay for (some) single mothers to cloth and feed their multiple illegitimate children is giving of myself…more than I want.

    And the hours I spend trying to teach some of these socially and psychologically maladjusted children has cost me YEARS of my life. You think being a single mother is hard – try being a teacher to a whole class of children of single parent homes year after year.

  • Presh7Hill

    @ Greg

    Why? If I can make sure the child is well taken care of, nurtured, exposed to a variety of cultures, educated, has solid and healthy relationships with men (including his/her father), in what world would this hurt a child? Especially if I chose to adopt as a single parent, I KNOW I would be doing a world of difference than a foster home or orphanage would do.

    I think advocating that women marry just because marriage is the thing to do is dangerous. I’m not going to run and out marry any old random dude and what I need/am looking for I just haven’t found. So, as a spiritual, educated, cultured, smart, and wonderful black woman, I can’t be a parent unless a man validates me? That’s bullsh*t.

  • Greg

    “If I can make sure the child is well taken care of, nurtured, exposed to a variety of cultures, educated, has solid and healthy relationships with men (including his/her father)”

    You included a very important aspect here: FATHERS

    “So, as a spiritual, educated, cultured, smart, and wonderful black woman, I can’t be a parent unless a man validates me? That’s bullsh*t.”

    And chose to neglect him here: My concern isn’t a women’s validation but the best interest of the Child. And fathers are more essential for this than “spiritual, educated, cultured, smart, and wonderful”

    If that’s the only crucial criteria than should not ALL children be removed from ANY family for one more “spiritual, educated, cultured, smart, and wonderful”?!

  • Tonton Michel

    “You didn’t get pregnant on accident – you got pregnant on STUPID.”

    That is a game winner.

  • Uralee

    @ Greg

    “If that’s the only crucial criteria than should not ALL children be removed from ANY family for one more “spiritual, educated, cultured, smart, and wonderful”?!”

    Where did I say this was the only crucial criteria? And to piggyback on that comment, there are kids growing up in some pretty messed up homes with both parents, so yeah – maybe some kids need to be taken and put with families that are “spiritual, educated, cultured, smart, and wonderful”?!”

    I’m not saying at all that fathers aren’t important. But let’s not pretend that a fatherless child living with a single mother in poverty on public assistance barely getting by is in the same boat as a fatherless child living with a mother of affluence. Let’s not pretend that a fatherless child that wasn’t planned for is the same as a fatherless child that was totally planned and prepared for. Like I said before – completely different.

    Stop twisting my words. We can just agree to disagree here.

  • latrell

    her kids (all 3) are from the same person

  • latrell

    This is what happens when you make assumptions smh you judge and spread hate. No she doesn’t have three different baby fathers. As a watcher of her’s she stated in an old vid that all her kids were from the same person. If you do your research you would know she was in a toxic relationship.

  • Greg

    Uhmmmmm, and you are?!?!?!

    Let’s not pretend that single-mother households are doing such a great job that they’ve surpassed the nuclear family in terms on successes as opposed to the disasters of filling up the prison system and the poverty rolls. They happen to be the BEST predictor for horrible lives of their children and poverty.

    They SUCK generally and are the scourge of every community they are a part of. otherwise we wouldn’t be consistently offering public help to such wonderful families would we?

  • Anzie

    Perspective,

    I’ll consider your perspective on single black mothers seriously when you can write properly. I know plenty of single black mothers whose small children wouldn’t have made as many grammatical and spelling errors as you have.

  • Anzie

    In fact there is a proposal to make single parenting a form of child abuse. That is what they are speaking of when they say that people are trying to criminalize black women for being single parents. Get up on your current affairs. Here, I’ll help you out on this one:
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/02/glenn-grothman-wisconsin-law-single-parenthood-child-abuse_n_1316834.html

  • Anzie

    It’s disturbing to me that black women cannot read a blog or forum that they look to for uplifting or a few moments of free time from the realities of her world without being attacked and bombarded with all the ways that she is wrong in everyone’s eyes. Not just the majority population but especially in her community. I don’t understand why a blog that is geared for black women works to her detriment.

    Secondly, it is also disturbing that both men and other WOMEN completely disregard any male accountability. I keep seeing men talking about women being accountable. Go talk to your homeboys and tell him the same, cause I know you don’t. That’s one of those man-pass issues. TUH!

    Lastly, for the single moms if a man doesn’t want to deal with you because you have children then he just isn’t for you. Period. No need to get bent out of shape. No need to doubt yourselves. Keep doing what you do. It’s funny because whenever a man expresses his doubt about a relationship with me because I have children I let him know “oh okay that’s cool, no worries. You take care.” Convo done. But after that they continue to call and plead their case. Handle them like that. You are not a desperate charity case waiting for someone to be willing to share his life with you and your children. Eff them! Tell them to move around. If he can’t SEE you and yours then he don’t need to see you. Period.

    Love yourself first, kids second, and anybody who deserves your love after that <3<3

  • L

    Fakeass so called Black nationalist. All you black dudes can do is talk s***t . YOU ALL DONT DO ANYTHING OR BUILD ANYTHING! IF ANYTHING- you all destroy. SO PLEASE CUT THE CRAP.

    I am nobodys mother so I cannot speak for single moms but miss me with that talking down to the little women crap. Nobody is PROMOTING single motherhood- at least noone I know and yes I know alot of educated young single no children slim Black women who are not waiting on anyone to elevate them.

    Why dont you go to a site geared to Black men and talk down to or at them…ask them why so many of them REFUSE to parent their BLACK children….I have a theory and I say they REFUSE to parent their Black children and they find it so easy to discard,abuse their BLACK children and the Black mothers because they are BLACK.(YES-nappy haired, dark skin- BLACK!!!!. IF the women and children were lighter with silky hair the black man would stick around and BUILD something and PARENT his children…RIGHT!?.) Why dont you go and ask the Black man why he places such a low value on BLACK WOMEN AND BLACK CHILDREN!

    P.S.- Black women are not *YOUR WOMEN*(atleast I am not) and alot of us are not waiting around for you all to build anything. FAKEASS BLACK NATIONALIST

  • L

    @keep it real

    LIES, LIES, LIES!!!!!!!!!!! I agree but its not Black women lying. It is BLACK MEN! BLACK MEN have been shucking and jiving for decades now and EVERYONE excuses them.Liberals and FEMINISTS did not destroy the Black family- BLACK MEN did. Men ask women to marry. Black women are still here raising the children- WHERE ARE THE BLACK MEN!!!!!?????? As soon as the coast was clear BLACK MEN TOOK OFF and when they were there(the few) alot of them still did not do anything- That is where the expression *I CAN DO BAD ALL BY MYSELF *CAME FROM

    WHY dont black men admit that they do not want BLACK CHILDREN or the responsibilities of nation building, community empowerment- at least they do not want these things if they are, BLACK! Admit it, Black man- and free the Black woman.

  • L

    *Free the Black woman(well the ones who dont have a clue- which sadly seem to be alot of them)

  • LI

    @Qon/eshowoman/kigali:

    YOU ARE A DEMON< AND I FEEL SORRY FOR ANY CHILD, MALE OR FEMALE, THAT YOU WOULD SO CALL NURTURE.

  • seventeen

    ‘My concern isn’t a women’s validation but the best interest of the Child. And fathers are more essential for this than “spiritual, educated, cultured, smart, and wonderful” ‘ – Greg

    Awesome!, what you have expressed is Peace itself. Unfortunately, I get the impression that many women are more satisfied by finance than they are concerned about comprehensive negligence.

    I would never willingly suffer a child the right to a Father. It doesn’t matter how affluent I may become, absent Fatherhood is an example of neglect.

  • Si On Da

    YES!!! @Anzie…

    Tell these single (black) moms to stop asking childless men for affirmative action when it comes to dating & commitment…

  • BrownSugared

    Long time lurker, but I’m sorry, i had to reply because this hit way too close to home.
    I’m a 24 year old mother of an amazing little boy. Not to beep my own horn, but I did manage to graduate from college on time, and got a job as an RN making more money than people older than i with full careers make. Personality wise, I haven’t been a social butterfly since having my son, but i still have my close circle of friends, travel, go to church, etc. I do take care of myself, have had my own place since i found out i was preggo and my son’s father and i have a cordial relationship

    In the last couple of years of dating since i had my son, i have had a relationship with a bank officer, a pharmacist, police officer, a doctor at my job (a full fledged MD, not a resident) and am currently involved with a sweet manager. I say all that to say that in my relationships and others that i’ve only briefly dated, my child has been a point of contention in only pne relationship. In all the others, he was a non-factor in that it was never held against me that i had a child, and was actually bonus points for one (he fell for me when he saw how i was with my child).
    Point is, quality is quality. If i am damaged goods, it’s because i have other insecurities that have caused my relationships to fail (it’s a cycle i’ve just started to notice) but i’m not damaged because of my kid. In fact, i daresay i wouldn’t be half the person i am today without him. I’ve never had a problem meeting quality men who wanted a relationship even though i had a child, and i’ve never even had a problem meeing the familys of these men who want a “damaged girl”. I bring my son up casually first conversation with a guy that i know is feeling me so he has the chance to let it go right then and there

    Whew! Sorry so long! Yeah i may be damaged, but it’s with the same baggage a lot of us ladies carry. The minute my son becomes a factor in me being able to find a man or maintain a relationship, i’ll let u guys know :)

  • BrownSugared

    Oops sorry for the typos, typing on my broken screen. Dropped my phone yesterday :(

  • Anzie

    Bingo! @BrownSugared, I too am a nurse and I have amazing boys. Most of the men I have dated have found us fun, interesting, and delightful to be around. Anybody who had a problem with dating me because of my kids is someone that chooses not to date a woman with kids (although they tend to change their mind when I say “now worries” but too late). That doesn’t mean that there is a problem with me. That just means that they choose not to date people with kids.

    There really is no need to attack either side on this issue. People are free to make choices. But I will say this about all of the single people who have such negative things to say about single mothers. Why are all of you single??? There is a or some reasons for why you are just as there are for us. Our children are an outside factor that some choose to focus on. Maybe you all should focus on what’s inside of you that keeps you single. Just a thought.

  • BrownSugared

    Thanks Anzie! I dont know if my other comment posted so i’ll keep it short. In no way am i encouraging single motherhood or saying it’s all good because please believe, this wasnt the life that i had envisioned for myself. I’m just saying that the reason i’m single isnt because i’m a mom. I’m single for the same reason my best friends, family, coworkers, even the ladies on clutch are… It isnt because i cant find a man, or even because i cant find a good man. It’s because i havent found the RIGHT good man yet,

  • Tonton Michel

    ” introduced Senate Bill 507, which would formally consider single parenthood a contributing factor to child abuse, if passed into law.”

    That is not criminalizing single parenthood or saying it is a form of child abuse. It means exactly what it says “contributing factor”.

    “Section 1. 48.982 (2) (g) 2. of the statutes is amended to read: 48.982 (2) (g) 2. Promote statewide educational and public awareness campaigns and materials for the purpose of developing public awareness of the problems of child abuse and neglect. In promoting those campaigns and materials, the board shall emphasize nonmarital parenthood as a contributing factor to child abuse and neglect.
    Section 2. 48.982 (2) (g) 4. of the statutes is amended to read:
    48.982 (2) (g) 4. Disseminate information about the problems of and methods of preventing child abuse and neglect to the public and to organizations concerned with those problems. In disseminating that information, the board shall emphasize nonmarital parenthood as a contributing factor to child abuse and neglect.”

    It doesnt target women alone or black women specifically in fact there is no target other than child abuse and neglect.

  • ExactlyWhatIthink

    Single mothers are not damaged goods. Of course, there are individuals who are damaged goods and some may happen to be single mothers. With that being said, I do believe one of the reasons why so many black women arent married id because they put the cart before the horse. I also believe that single mothers cannot deny that too many fellow single mothers are failing severely and this gives single mothers a bad name. We all know the devestating statistics concerning children of single mother so I will not list them, but I do believe that these cannot be ignored.

  • ExactlyWhatIthink

    What are the benefits of single parenthood? For parent and/or child?

  • Krissytramel

    I’m glad my husband saw me as a human being with feelings instead of “damaged goods”. I never begged any man to date/marry me. If they didn’t want to date me because of my son they were free to do so. My husband and I were friends for atleast 8 years before we started dating, and even then I was fine just being his friend (no sex involved) In fact, he pursued me even though I wasn’t ready to date yet.

  • Shut up

    Where they stupid? Yes. Was it on purpose? No.

  • natalie

    I know I may have posted the same message elsewhere, but I truly believe that as black women we have got to truly explore alternative ways of thinking about and managing the “fatherlessnes” crisis in our community. WE have the power to do so if we will face the reality that with great rights come even greater responsibility. I stumbled across a cartoon that summed up the hyprocrisy that has maintained the the current crisis for decades now and I am deeply disturbed that as this problem continues to get progressively worse those that dominate the dialogue continue to reduce the issue to mens need to simply “man up.”

    http://www.tastymojo.com/LouisvilleMojo/photos_pgp/093/PG7432020080109062112593093.jpg

  • natalie

    I first began my advocacy of creating an awareness of the negative impact of feminist indoctrination on society (the black/brown community in particular) in the early years of my clinical practice and in various academic circles.I began to see a paradigm shift that led to less gender neutrality in various treatment modalities. This shift was parallel to the “change” that was taking place in society’s feminist influenced thinking as a whole. The shift to focusing exploration of womens issues in the context of their relationship to the men in their lives was indicative of society’s eventual progression towards the current “blame game” that takes place in many gender focused discussions. We began emphasizing accountability for men while extending them very little compassion. This was ruthless of course and it is respecting men but not necessarily loving them. On the other hand society began to emphasize compassion for women while extending them very little accountability.. it is infantilizing and it is loving women but not necessarily respecting them. (Goldich, 2011)
    There are a number of byproducts of this but perhaps one of the most dmaging to my community has been the pivot away from referring to unwed mothers in our community as such to being lumped in with divorced mothers and widows for the now all encompassing term “single mother”. With this for example came the unintended consequence of empowering generations of women towards acceptance of the current “babymama” phenomena. You see referring to an unwed mother as a single mother is empowering in that it createss the narrative of a “strong black woman that made it in spite of…”. So if a child attends college it is the testatment of the strength of a single mother..if the same child were to become incarcerated it is an indictment of the colossal failure of men/fathers. Unbelieveable! Another uninteneded consequence is the current “boy crisis” where the education disparity is growing, male suicide is increasing and the anti-male bias and bashing in society continues to become common practice.

  • natalie

    These idealogues no longer push for equality but they dominate the dialogue that has led to both subtle and overt notions of men=bad, women=good. I am old enough to remember a time when the social contract that had existed for thousands of years between man and woman was the crux of healthy communities. No, everything was not perfect, but children were more likely to be raised within the structure of family. The current conflicts between men and women and the subsequent break down of black family was not as prevalent as it has become. Something happened as the women’s liberation movement began to push more aggressively for “equality” and for the rights of women to have their roles evolve in society. (Not entirely a bad thing as I am a twenty year CHOICE advocate) With this push the social contract was broken on one side.
    While men continued to be held to an expectation that would honor their side of the social contract (Chivalrous, protectors and providers, etc.), radical ideologues began to reshape the thinking of society with growing influence in many areas including education, policy and in my personal experience even the feminization of psychology.
    Feminist began to assert the notion that patriarchal oppression was responsible for many of society’s ills and at its most radical end that the social contract that had protected marriage and family was merely constructed for the benefit of those that sought to keep women “oppressed.” We swallowed hook line and sinker and began enjoying rights without responsibility which is best characterized in the feminist mantra “my body my choice”….someone elses responsibility? And what do we have to show for being “sexually liberated” with COMPLETE control over reproduction (20+options for birth control pre-conception and access to safe abortions or adoption post conception)?
    An illigitimacy rate that increased exponentially over several decades aggresively approaching 8 in 10 while we continue to reduce it to merely a “need for black men to man up.” Our community has been held hostage by radical self-serving idealogues for decades and we now see the detrimental impact of buying into this ideology and the subsequent policies. As a woman whose life has spanned five decades now…I’m tired of advocating in the trenches for a womans right to choose while most only enjoy the rights without a willingness to embrace the brunt of the responsibility that comes with these rights. Choice is not just about post conception decision making but is also about the pre conception decisions and options that we have to prevent having another generation of children being subjected to the downward trajectory that tend to be associated with unwed motherhood. Selfish! We have to pivot away from the idea of ourselves and our children as the victims of mens ill intent and not our own decision making. STanding with backs to the mirror has led us away from mother+father+child to mother+child+child support =family.SMH! Men have a role in this as well but I am tired of the defensive posturing when a few of us black women communicate our frustration with “us” in this mess.

  • natalie

    I always hear the argument that we wouldnt have to define manhood for men if fathers would step up, but the idea that ones choice to engage in recreational sex that led to an unwanted pregnancy and the womans unilateral decision to go to term with the idea that a consent to sex is a consent to fatherhood and non-compliance with our “expectation of what a man SHOULD do” because men are no longer manning up, as opposed to accepting responsibility for our role in the current fatherlessness crisis is beginning to be challenged by many in our community that have had enough! It is a very interesting dichotomy where we are vocal about our strenngth and independence while maintaining the idea of ourselves as victims of mens ill intent. The very concept of focusing our attention on condoms (male symbol of sexual (ir) responsibility) and mens behavior post conception is a blatant attempt to shift focus away from the 20+ options we have available to us to prevent unwanted pregnancies and the lack of responsibility WE demonstrated pre-conception.

  • natalie

    You see by focusing on condom use and post-conception responsibility it focuses on male responsibility or lack of and absolves us of any responsibility for the personal choices that we made. When men “walk away” we refer to them as deadbeats but the top three reasons that they walk away are the very same reasons that women put their children up for adoption or abort. We dont refer to women as deadbeats for “abandoning” the responsibility that comes with conception but we extend compassion to our girls and women about the options they have should they not be in an ideal financial situation, relationship or the potential impact on career. Do we not believe that men experience the same anxieties and fears and can be impacted in a such a way as well? As one that has worked in community mental health and in private practice with men whose pain has often been dismissed and/or completely invisible to society I think its time we begin exploring these issues from their perspective as well. I fought as have other women, too hard for a womans right to choose, while most simply enjoy the rights without responsibility.

  • alldawg

    how many baby daddies is too many baby daddies, each child means a different family by a different man. Self perception is different than potential mate perception….

  • CHE

    You are an educated FOOL!

    Liberalism and feminism has little to nothing to do with this issue.Yes, maybe for a few and I stress a FEW Black women- they were influenced by the feminist movement to become mothers without being married but those Black women were nowhere near the majority of Black women; in fact most Black women were opposed to and probably still are opposed to the feminist movement. There is something else going on here. I am not a single mother but I have known some and if anyone thinks the majority of these women are going around sleeping with every Tom, Dick and Harry, well, you all need to check your biases and stereotypes at the door. I personally feel alot of Black girls and women are not being taught commonsense lessons. Everyone was/is so busy trying to save the Black man that Black girls/women were/are totally ignored(even by other Black women) and this and other things are the result.

  • TJ

    You are disgraceful. Stoned? Really? Disgraceful. People should be ashamed that you would write such hate speech. You are a bully and a fear monger. You are obnoxious and pathetic. I wish you a life full of experiences that will grown you and a man/woman that will stay with you for so long as that can stand your neo-conservative, white washed ways.

    Ignorance at it’s finest. This is a fine example of how using old lines and conservatism pushes people out of the argument. The glory days are gone old timer. This ‘issue’ has to do with respecting one’s body, respecting women’s choices, teaching young girls to make better choices with sexual relationships, teaching men that dual parent households are the utmost importance in the survival and enrichment of a generation. The same neo-cons complaining about single motherhood are the same ones complaining about abortions. That happens very frequently. Many of these women are unknowingly applauded by the media for making wise decisions. Single motherhood? What about all the fathers? Perhaps we should re-educate our boys to be men. To be partners, to be respectful men of God, to serve women and their families, to above all respect LIFE enough to recognize when they’ve created one that that LIFE is worthy of being nurtured, protected, and loved into adulthood.

    You sir or mam, need to get a life and an education.

  • CHE

    Yes, you have made some good points and I do think Black women have to take resposibility for their part in the oow birthrate and other issues in the Black community…. I have even said on occasion that SOME Black women seem to be allergic to birth control but I still think after reading your diatribe that you are an enabler and seem to be absolving men of any responsibility. The issue is more complex than you make it out to be. I know Black America and I know West Indian America and I know UK Caribbeans and you find some of the same issues more or less in all of these places…..so I am assuming there are certain common issues in all of these places where you have a large group of Black women and men. I really dont think Blacks(or I should say Black women) want to face the fact that Black men do not want the responsibility of the Black community and they are SHOWING you and TELLING you that loud and clear.

    I think the focus should be off of Black men and not for the reasons you present…..Black women and girls need to start thinking outside of the box. The Black community is not working for Black women and girls anymore and maybe Black women and girls need to go outside of those communities to survive and thrive and ENJOY life while they still have it. This is not a radical idea- this is how the different races?? in the world came about. This is how the discussion needs to be framed in my opinion; Older Black women need to wake up and actually SEE what is going on and EDUCATE their daughters. This will change EVERTHING but I think this will be for the good of everyone….especially BLACK WOMEN AND GIRLS and that is the most important thing…RIGHT?

  • Donald K Sumner

    @Natalie,

    Well written. Women have many more options to prevent pregnancies, yet they seem unwilling to exercise them. These items are often given away for FREE at a local clinic!!!!

  • Donald K Sumner

    Exception maybe?

    I wonder is bw will do the same thing with respect to short bm!?

  • Donald K Sumner

    They are bad the same way bw consider short bm bad!?

  • CHE

    If you mean Black Women make up half of the HIV/Aids cases in America….NO WE DO NOT.PLEASE GO and read SOMETHING and stop spreading this crap.

  • Donald K Sumner

    @TJ,

    He himself is not advocating for stoning, etc. He is simply pointing out how things like this get dealt with in other cultures and/or countries. That in and of itself is NOT hate speech. However, the overarching point is the showing that women who do the sh** bw do in our community are shamed severely in other places in the world, and have GREAT INCENTIVES not to go that route…

  • The last laugh

    Everyone is saying that all three of her children are by different men. So how do the two autistic ones have the same father? Or does she only have two baby daddy’s and not three?

  • TypicalBlackWoman…

    @Anzie
    …..DEAD……

  • Socially Maladjusted

    Single mothers are not damaged goods.

    Argument done.

    I’d say that heterosexual marriage is the damaged good – guilty as charged by never married babymama and divorced babymama.

    That many women can’t be wrong about what’s right for them and what’s
    wrong for them.

    Both agree that to babymama is the right way and marriage is the wrong way.

    So get over it.

    The Babymama revolution is what we call a Renaissance, a return to the old ways that marks

    THE DEATH OF PATRIARCHY

    good

  • natalie

    @ CHE

    …..ok! I may not agree with you but I respect your opinion. However, your insult is precisely the reason the discourse has been stuck at a standstill for decades. Helping you make the connection isn’t worth the keystrokes..But I thank you for you response.

  • natalie

    Of course I recognize that this issue demnands a more nuanced discussion that what I have offered so far.

  • natalie

    http://whitehouseboysmen.org/blog/

    After providing funding for a council on women and girls (2 years ago), the prsident continues to ignore this proposal for a white house council on boys to men. Why? The NOW lobby cotinues to diminish the importance of this multi-cultural, bi-partisan effort to address the needs of boys and men.

  • natalie

    @Tj

    re: “teaching them to serve their women and children”
    Thats part of the problem…we have been encouraged and supported towards an evolving role in society and I have no problem with that.However, we maintain the expectation that mens role will remain a traditionally defined one. We have assigned utilitarian value to the lives of men where their value lies in their “doings” as opposed to simply valuing their “beings”. I was alarmed while watching coverage of the syrian crisis last night..As has become common practice in western journalism, death and loss wa reported as “27 dead including women and children”. A statement like this alone communicates a very clear message to men the value (or lack of) that we have placed on their lives. Society is reaching a tipping point and for those that have not been connected to the conversation regarding millions of men across the world now aggressively “pushing back” at these antiquated expectations, policies, etc. In our community in particular the ones that have stood to benefit the most from “defining manhood” for men are US (women). We define mens roles not with a desire for whats best for them but rather whats best for us.. Every man defines what manhood is for himself and if his definition doesnt jibe well with ones idea of manhood and masculinity then it doesnt make him less a man it just make s him “not the type of man you deal with.”

  • Greg

    Thank You Socially Maladjusted..
    (CHE and Socially Maladjusted are staunch Socialist they just don’t tell you as much!)

    I keep trying to inform people that the destruction of the Black Community via the elimination of father-headed households (Patriarchy) was the PRECISE goal of black females corrupted by the Hate Movement of Feminism and that to imply that black men were behind it was intended as distraction for male castigation and the resultant State $$$. Communism/Socialism basically. That’s why CHE (lol, CHE-Revolution much?) above was compelled to respond acidly. as well as Socially Backward here:

    “The Babymama REVOLUTION is what we call a Renaissance, a return to the old ways that marks

    THE DEATH OF PATRIARCHY [Father-headed households]”

    Gendered Socialism. LOL

    Priceless.

    P.S. doesn’t it seem odd that Liberals/Socialist would try to foist onto Gays & Lesbians such a destructive/patriarchal/”hateful” institution such as marriage? Why wouldn’t LGBT be upset at Liberals for trying to punish them w/ marriage. Shouldn’t Gays and Liberals be at ea. others throats?

    It wouldn’t make sense unless you understood that both groups have the same goal.

    “”A [strategy] might be to fight for same sex marriage and its benefits, and then, once granted, redefine the institution completely, to demand the right to marry not as a way of adhering to society’s moral codes but rather to debunk a myth and radically alter an archaic institution.” — Michelangelo Signorile, “Bridal Wave,” OUT Magazine, December/January 1994, p.161

    The Communist Manifesto would also give you a clue. (1948):

    “Abolition of the family! Even the most radical flare up at this infamous proposal of the Communists.”

    –As well they should. It is a disgusting concept! Karl Marx believed that the family structure was inherently exploitative, with capitalists treating their wives and children as property and bequeathing their accumulated assets to their children (he saw the concept of inheritance as a horrible evil). His solution? Children should be raised by the state, marriage and inheritance should be eliminated, and noncommital sex should be the only form of relationship. The man was a lunatic, and most people don’t even have any idea how extreme and unrealistic some of his views were, because they’ve never bothered to read his Manifesto.

    THIS IS WHAT CHE, SOCIALLY MALADJUSTED and Unfortunately the BLACK COMMUNITY has been operating under the last 45 years

    A Communist Revolution.
    I wouldn’t have gone this deep but CHE and S&M broached it so hey.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    So greggy

    instead of reading and educating yourself you’ve taken a crash course in how to copy & paste passages from dubious articles posted on those lunatic fringe “men rights” websites.

    LOL!

    smh

    can’t be bothered with this right now I’m off to the gym in a mo.

    I’ll leave you with this though greggy, I’d stop going on about socialism if I was you – when your buddies in the tea party were hurling socialist labels at Obama, all it did was make young people want to find out what socialism is actually about.

    They found out that Obama is as far from being socialist as it gets, stopped liking him and started loving -

    SOCIALISM.

    guess what came next?

    The Occupy Movement,

    which has overtaken the fake tea party as the “grass roots movement” with the strongest momemtum.

    shut up greg and sit yo clown ass down.

  • Si On Da

    @Anzie

    I will get at you coherently & let’s test your comprehension skills…

    You are a single mother, so it is expected that you come with bias…

    @Perspective made excellent points that you could not eloquently refute, so you attack his grammar & spelling errors… Come up with some better rebuttals

    So, you need to have some org@sms & come back to the conversation like a mature human beings…

  • Si On Da

    like a mature human being*

  • Ms. Terious

    @perspective, i’m going to tell you like i told “keeping it real” on another post (i’m convinced y’all are one and the same, so much of this is a copy and paste job for me), which is, you would have a much better time on this site if you’d stop regurgitating the same point like a f*cking machine. it’s not that i don’t agree with SOME of what you say. the issue is you are preaching to the wrong choir, boo. do you know how weird it is for you, as a black man, with all of your own societal issues and baggage to deal with, to come onto a site geared toward black women and preach about all the ways in which black women are f*ck-ups? i liken your incessant ranting to gene marks’ “if i were a poor black kid” article (http://WWW.FORBES.COM/SITES/QUICKERBETTERTECH/2011/12/12/IF-I-WAS-A-POOR-BLACK-KID/).

    it’s way too easy to come up with solutions to problems you will never and have never experienced first hand because you, my dear, are not a [black] woman. doesn’t mean you can’t have an opinion, but being opinionated, black, or even coming into the world through a black birth canal, doesn’t give you special right to pick black women apart anymore than me being a black woman gives me the right to pick black men apart. why? because i have NO IDEA what it’s like to be a black man. therefore, waxing poetic about some utopia in which black men think with their brains instead of their d*cks; or look at children as people who need their love, care, and attention, no matter who the mother is; or have enough standards/sense to say “this raw nut i’m about to bust is not worth having to deal this woman I could give two sh*ts about for the rest of my life so let me strap up” is all pointless.

    [radical idea coming in 5...4...3...2...] your advice might be more helpful if you were actually speaking to those young men who may need a smart brotha such as yourself to get in their ear and challenge them to make smarter decisions. oh wait, those young men aren’t the fruit of your loins so heaven forbid you should try to teach them anything, right? (not saying that’s how you feel, but it’s quite obvious that you avoid any comment that asks you to hold black men accountable for their actions so…. *shrugs*)

    cas a 30 y/o black woman with all the “right stats”, i might be inclined to chill on this pedestal you’ve put women like me on and look down at the “undesirables” with a dismissive “he’s talking about them, not me” eye. but thankfully, i don’t need your validation, nor do i have to shame women who haven’t gone my route to make myself look/feel better (note: i realize women are some of the biggest offenders when it comes to that). pardon the cliche, but my swag is way too in tact for that. so what i choose to do instead is talk to and, dare i say it, LISTEN to those young ladies who may not be as lucky as i was to have a mother to help me understand my worth—see where their heads are and where i might be able to deter them from making decisions that may not be a good look. i’m the unofficial “big sister” to a number of young ladies and have heard numerous “thank yous” from them saying i’ve influenced them to want more for themselves despite where they come from or the circumstances they were born into. it’s quite a rewarding experience. you should try it.

    CLEARLY WOMEN SHOULD AND MUST MAKE BETTER CHOICES with their hearts and bodies. but we should seriously ask ourselves how many black people—male or female—know what their lives are truly worth? that they have more value in them than what’s between their legs (i think even you would agree that this is just as much, if not more of an issue for black men, who have taken on the “all races of women wanna f*ck me, so i’m good” mentality)? the answer is as simple as “Each One Teach One.” as i encouraged you…oops…i mean your bro “keeping it real” in the other post, try hanging at group homes, juvenile detention centers, and other institutions for at-risk boys who may be on the brink of self-destruction. start a mentor program and encourage other black men who have a little sense and education to mentor as you all are the LEAST likely out of any group of people to do so. surely that has nothing to do with the “i got mine you gotta get yours” mentally many black folk carry with them once they’ve “made it” [insert side-eye here]. bottom line is, your preachy tactics are not helping anyone. you are so pressed to school somebody, but are you man enough to go to your brothers and do a little preaching? do you honestly go up to other black men with your finger-wagging and say “you need to do better”? are the same ways you and your ilk claim black women uphold single motherhood not the same ways black men uphold abandonment, lack of accountability and blatant bullsh*t in other black men? i just think your energy would be better spent being a mentor to young men instead of judge and jury to young women. and furthermore, i’m sure if we get to the roots of your family tree there are a couple of whores and a few unwanted pregnancies. so if you’re not gonna be of any real use, at least spare us the self-righteous rhetoric.

  • Ms. Terious

    *as a 30 y/o black woman…

  • Si On Da

    @Socially Maladjusted

    Where was the rebuttal in that comment… You are bad as some of these women…

    SSTTE

  • Socially Maladjusted

    si no pfft

    hmm?

    better question

    what part of greggy poo’s offering effectively addressed, much less refuted my comment?

    All I saw was copy & paste conspiracy theory about socialism, marxism and whatnot, which tells me ass clown boy was having his usual rehearsed argument with opponent that only exists in his hallucinations.

    Let me correct you on something -

    else :-)

    I’m as GOOD good as some of these women.

    LOL!

    sigh smh

  • Greg

    So you ARE a Socialist!!!!
    Just wanted you to admit it. I was well aware of it. Others needed to know though.
    All you had to do was say I was right.

    What’s with all the nipple-tickling?

    –That’s what happens when you nail them Si On Da:

    They confirm it proudly (my supposed “hallucination”)
    and then start FLIRTING. LOL.
    Huge turn-on.
    CHE will come out the closet shortly as well.

    He had no rebuttal. There isn’t one. Insults were just the “cherry” on top
    “Yes” would of sufficed S&M.

    “much less refuted my comment?”

    What was there to refute?
    I just mentioned your political slant and you verified it.
    Why would you be mad?

  • Socially Maladjusted

    groggy

    what the hell are you jumping around for idiot?

    LMAO!

    You haven’t proven anything except that you’re even more deranged than we suspected.

    Can’t see anywhere that you can even infer that I’ve admitted to being a socialist from what I said, but I will admit to preferring socialism to CRAP-italism.

    Now what?

    am I about to be snuffed out, erased into oblivion because you’ve cunningly “exposed me” as one of them thar socialists?

    OO-ooh

    What a fool.

    LMAO!

    Don’t make me have to break socialism over your head again you twit.

  • Greg

    Thank You.

  • Si On Da

    @Socially Maladjusted

    I want to avoid the pissing match & respectfully agree to disagree…

    My stance is this, women can choose any man they want, and make children as they please, in this article, they indirectly shaming childless men for overlooking single mothers… I think you can see how that poses serious issues…

    No matter if a man has an agenda or not about OOW children created by irresponsible men & women, it will always look bad defending them because of the net-negative they have on society… Even if the male is angry & bitter that he isn’t getting the p*ssy at the moment…

    ATEOTD, it is about the children…

    So, there is my justification for shaming & thug-blaming…’

    @Greg @SM I still do not know where the disagreement lies, and the only reason @Greg & others keep re-iterating those same seemingly irrefutable talking points is because women refuse to address them… Or take responsibility for their part

    Fin

  • CHE

    @Greg:

    Hi….Its CHE….and I am using one of the names my PARENTS gave me….so its not a reference to socialism or Che Guevara.

    I didnt read anything you posted today because I know it is incomprehensible garbage as usual but…FYI….I am a Black female college student who comes to Clutch because it is geared towards YOUNG BLACK WOMEN. Reading your bitter black man spiel and your references leaves me to suspect that you are an old dude, so………WHY ARE YOU HERE?.

  • Greg

    Yes you are HIgh.
    I don’t care who you are, what psychotic named you or who’s property you think you own. I’ll write what I want. You get a private site holla. Til til then your just another mixed up wart of a public site. Consider yourself “schooled” and try to get your tuition back.

  • Greg

    Yes you are HIgh.
    I don’t care who you are, what psychotic named you or who’s property you think you own. I’ll write what I want. You get a private site holla. Til til then your just another mixed up wart on a public site. Consider yourself “schooled” and try to get your tuition back.

  • CHE

    @Greg:

    Dude what! LMAO! Thank you.

  • Greg

    “However, your insult is precisely the reason the discourse has been stuck at a standstill for decades. Helping you make the connection isn’t worth the keystrokes..But I thank you for you response.”

    No, Thank YOU CHE.

  • CHE

    @Greg:

    *sigh*

    LMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAO!

    Nighty-night Gregster. Sleep tight.

  • grateful

    come-on everybody, lighten up.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    @si no da

    “Greg & others keep re-iterating those same seemingly irrefutable talking points is because women refuse to address them”

    What irrefutable talking points would those be for YOU si?

    That women keep choosing the i>”wrong men” to babymama for?

    LOL!

    Sorry mate, but that’s not a rational talking point, it’s an irrational talking point that comes from an emotional place and cannot be challenged with logic or facts.

    How about this one –

    Marxists and Socialists caused the breakdown of the family.

    Well how is that possible when you live in a capiltalist society? Family breakdown in america aint happening under a socialst system.

    I’d say there’s much stronger evidence to indict capitalism as anti-family since everything in this capilatist system is consciously designed to alienate people from each other, to reduce us to atomized consumer units who needs are channeled by saturation advertising to buy stuff.

    We buy STUFF to fill the gaps in our lives where PEOPLE should be.

    Men and women are no longer allowed to seek fulfilment in each other. Instead we’re tricked into seeing each other as competitors for jobs, status, stuff, and to apsire to -

    independence.

    Who does that benefit? clearly not you, since it’s obvious you are painfully unhappy.

    It benefits the corporations, ie the capiltalists – to have a society in which men and women see each other as enemies. Makes for more problems they can pretend to solve, but milk for all the dollars that not solving a problem brings in.

    I’m kool with you Si (and even greg despite his b itch assness) LOL! but I advise you to stand down before you take this somewhere only one of us will come back from. (that would be me).

    LOL!

  • Perspective

    Response to Ms. Terious

    “bottom line is, your preachy tactics are not helping anyone. you are so pressed to school somebody, but are you man enough to go to your brothers and do a little preaching? do you honestly go up to other black men with your finger-wagging and say “you need to do better”?”

    “CLEARLY WOMEN SHOULD AND MUST MAKE BETTER CHOICES with their hearts and bodies. ”

    Ummm – If women are making bad choices in men, as I’ve pointed out, and you just pointed out in your second sentence, then what is there to tell the men, who have been clearly identified as bad choices.

    Bad choices are supposed to be avoided. If women don’t avoid them, what’s the point in blaming the bad choice. HE IS IN FACT A BAD CHOICE. If these type of men exist why choose them? They should be avoided.

    I seriously feel that in the blameless culture and victimhood culture that black woman live in too often that getting with a bad choice is inconsequential to them because ultimately they feel they can blame him – because he was a bad choice.

    That’s stupid. I need say nothing more on that.

    Also as a black man what black women do is DIRECTLY my concern because they are the other half of the black community.

    Every kid out of wedlock is my concern because at some point I’m going to have to interact with these children who are too frequently becoming dysfunctional adults, or my children are going to have to deal with them.

    Every boy that a woman has with a piss poor man FOR WHATEVER REASON is another black boy who probably won’t make it to manhood and when or if he does he won’t be useful.

    I will have fewer allies on my side or men who know their duty as a man. I can’t build up the community as a black man without the numbers and large populations of inadequate males raised by single mothers.

    I don’t buy this crap about women going out here and getting with MR RIGHT who suddenly turns into MR WRONG just because she got pregnant and bounces. Take most of these single moms and put them on the stand – drag their sorry behind father of her children to court and its OBVIOUS AS DAY – these men were never in a position to be fathers nor good care takers.

    A lot of women simply have babies because their biological clock is ticking or simply they want to have them like an accessory, and then they B*tch and complain about how the man’s not there for the next 25 years while simultaneously preaching about how they’re so independent they can do it all alone. Then when you call them out on where they failed, they immediately jump up and blame the man who go back 25 years – we can see that he didn’t demonstrate any of the qualities that would let you know that he would be sticking around.

    These women are not getting married, and then getting pregnant.

    THEY ARE SLEEPING WITH THEIR BOYFRIENDS HAVING IRRESPONSIBLE UNPROTECTED SEX.

    and most of the individuals who grow up underneath these circumstances – FAIL – especially the males and women want NO PARTS OF THE RESPONSIBILITY AND THE PARTS THEY PLAYED. ZERO!

    Blame the man all day – when we really look at him – we’re left scratchin our heads why a woman allowed herself to get pregnant by a man who did not have a solid foundation.

    Bet you if I go out here and get with a coke head stripper, and end up being a single father, I’m not going to get any sympathy.

    (Extreme example) not saying that all the men have to crackheads or degenerates, but what I’m saying is when you look at most of these men that these single mothers were having unprotected sex with – THESE MEN DON’T SHOW THE SLIGHTEST SIGN OF GOING ANYWHERE.

    Why is it black women can be so forward thinking about their independence and education – BUT NOT THE MEN THEY DEAL WITH.

    Case closed!

  • Perspective

    @ Everyone,

    Notice how L’s comment didn’t address nor acknowledge any of my key points.

    I must say, that was a very typical move and to be expected. Not surprised at all.

  • Keep it Real

    Two horses pull a cart better than one. Always have. Always will. The black community’s reverence for the ‘strong black woman’ is KILLING our community. Not because being a strong woman is bad. But because nobody asks the more salient question, which is why do they have to be so strong. If I chop off my own foot and then hop 50 miles to get my kids something to eat, do I deserve a medal for the hopping or condemnation for chopping off my own foot? Probably some of both, but more condemnation. Black women have got to let this fixation on ‘swagger’ and drama go and start thinking about building strong, peaceful families, where they won’t be required to be Wonder Woman on a daily basis.

    I am hard on sisters for a reason. The woman is the moral compass of a people. Any people. If black women decided tomorrow that they would only have sex with guys who got A’s in school, guess what black men would do? They would get A’s in school. I mean even the thugs would come off the corner and start studying. If black women would decide that it is more important to build a strong family unit, than to be a strong individual, then they would 1) choose men with which it is possible to build a family and 2) humble themselves a bit and learn that they do not always have to be heard.

  • Perspective

    “I really dont think Blacks(or I should say Black women) want to face the fact that Black men do not want the responsibility of the Black community and they are SHOWING you and TELLING you that loud and clear.
    I think the focus should be off of Black men and not for the reasons you present…..Black women and girls need to start thinking outside of the box. The Black community is not working for Black women and girls anymore and maybe Black women and girls need to go outside of those communities to survive and thrive and ENJOY life while they still have it. This is not a radical idea- this is how the different races?? in the world came about. This is how the discussion needs to be framed in my opinion; Older Black women need to wake up and actually SEE what is going on and EDUCATE their daughters. This will change EVERTHING but I think this will be for the good of everyone….especially BLACK WOMEN AND GIRLS and that is the most important thing…RIGHT?”

    Oh boy –

    This was the gynocentric response by a woman who responded to Natalie. Take note of the complete absence of black boys

    Their total disregard for black boys and belief that girl should be their complete focus is not only selfish, arrogant, narcassictic, its insane when black men are the other half of the community, but it really goes to show you that many black women believe that they are somehow a different species from black men, who can operate independently of black men so much so that not only can they determine the sex of their offspring, but they don’t even need black men to reproduce black children

    These women are going to lead their daughters into the brick wall of lonliness when there will be no black men for them to be with, and as I’ve stated other races of men are not a refuge for black women, their communities are intact, and there is a benefit to keeping it whatever racial group they are.

    Other communities that are intact and satisfied with their own women, or other races of women from other communities that are intact (non-black), are going to chose their women or women from intact communities over black women first, as a rule.

  • Sasha

    Ten thousand times ‘YES’ to everything you said!

  • Perspective

    In showing someone the comment, I was asked, “Well aren’t black men doing the same thing, they’re talking about leaving the black community as well.” My response was there is a distinct difference. The men who are the most outspoken about hopping the fence are trying to do the right thing. These are traditional men, who are being told flat out by black women that they do not want a traditional structure that is not to matriarchal specifications. These are not men trying to avoid responsibility, nor accountability, and then take these inadequecies over the fence to other communities. Those that are serious about finding a wife, on the other side of the fence, and not just women for sex, know they can’t take that over there. They also recognize the reality that they really only have their own individual success to offer, which isn’t that great of a feeling when you have to compete with other races of men, or men of her own race, that have networks of other men (non-black) to work with, whom, overall, are going to have more to offer than you, unless you are really on point. Black women on the other hand, like this one, seem to believe that they can take their unaccountability right over the fence with them, or strong independence with them, or the notion of “black children” with them, which really makes no sense if you are hopping the fence. If she’s not willing to address accountability over here, what makes anyone think that she’s going to address it over there? What makes here think these other intact communities are going to accept that level of unaccountability to the point that you deflect away from argument? Furthermore, you’d have to throw “blackness” out. That’s why it’s called “hopping the fence.” Does she already have a black daughter and she’s trying to take her daughter over the fence? Here we go with the single mom/ ‘what intact communities desire and expect’ argument. Why would a non-black man want to raise a black child, or deal with a woman with a child, let alone a black child. Sure there are those out there who will accept; there are always exceptions, but this whole-saling that is going on is insane, as if this is a viable solution for all black women who simply want to leave, and can’t deal. It also perplexes me, those black women who have colorism issues, and have this mother-daughter complex, who seek to hop the fence and marry other races of men, and have daughters that will be biracial and be either the woman they have a complex about, (light skin b*tch) or they will live vicariously through their daughters “good hair” and “light skin,” which only illustrates her self-hate. If a woman thinks like this, she should be totally disregarded from the conversation because her intentions have little to do with black men’s inadequencies and more so with her inferiority complex. She’s simply trying to find a way to justify what she considers her only option to get away from the “ruthless” black male, when her true mission is to satisfy her lust and admiration for non-blacks, namely white men.
    Sometimes I feel like its not even about the argument that is being presented when it comes to some of these women; it’s the fact that in some way we are shattering their dream of dating interracially. I’ve come across so many women who literally don’t know,
    “Hey Sista, I’d hate to see you go, but I just had to let you know, you can’t take your basket of strong indepence and gynocentric matriarchal concepts over there and expect it to be accepted.”
    When you tell them that, they get mad. I’m like, “Hey chick, no need to get upset with me, I’m just letting you know, those other communities are intact, their men are strong and control the economic landscape, your sh*t ain’t gonna fly over there – I just hope you are aware, before you go over there and get your feelings hurt.”

    Strong independence or the mentalities that are inbetween the lines of what this woman is saying are for communities that are not intact; they are not for intact communities. Its just silly to me the way that some of these women think that they really have any other option than to be accountable. Black men’s options aren’t that great either, but a black male patriarch will always have more options than a black matriarch, because the world is patriarchal. These women are delusional. – @ CHE

  • Socially Maladjusted

    F uckin ‘ell

    The can’t get no puss ^^ mob have finished looking at big booty porn and worked themselves up into an anti-thug frenzy again.

    Will one of you hags take pity on em and give em some nani to munch on?

    At least it’ll shut up em for a while.

    LMAO!

  • Perspective

    I understand the older woman’s frustrations as well. She’s saying that she didn’t fight for women to have the choice to abort a child and expect women to be so unaccountable, and irresponsible. She takes ownership of having the ability to have the final say in excersing the right to have an abortion, as women should take on the responsibility once they embrace the power to choose. With power comes responsibility, but what has happened is that, as she stated, “Men=Bad and Women=Good.” Woman have been socialized to believe that because of this unbalanced sexually biased equation that no matter what decision they make if something bad happens it must be attached to the negative influence of some male somewhere. Combine this with the diplomatic immunity that women receive when they become mothers regardless of how they go there, and you have a recepie for complete and total lack of accountability, and I often wonder how much of a factor women not taking any of the necessary precautions themselves has to do with the idea that ultimately they can simply blame a man because men=bad and women=good, and therefore no matter what part they play it’s the man’s fault.

  • Keep it Real

    @Socially Maladjusted

    Marxists and Socialists caused the breakdown of the family.

    Well how is that possible when you live in a capiltalist society? Family breakdown in america aint happening under a socialst system.

    You live in the U.K. so you have to make assumptions about the U.S. Let me explain a few things. The black ghetto is essentially a Matriarchal Socialist quasi apartheid society and community. I’m not against Liberals, Socialist and liberal policies out of some stubborn ideology. I’m against them BECAUSE THEY DON’T WORK at least not in the hood. Today, there are a lot of black men who are players, thugs/convicts and bums. But how did this happen? Black men did not always abandon their families. From 1900 to 1960 (60 years) the majority of black women were married, almost every black kid had a father in the home and in some decades black women married at a higher percentage than white women. The black illegitimacy rate was between 10 to 24% from 1900 to 1960. These are facts not revisionist history. Today illegitimacy is 72%+ 85% in the worst ghettos). That’s an increase of over 50% or more in less than 50 years. Which is incredible when you think about it.

    The worst thing to ever happen to the black community was giving money to poor black women who were uneducated, unskilled, unemployed and unmarried for every kid she had. The poor black woman no longer needed the poor black man to put a roof over her head, food on the table and clothes on her and the kids backs. Hell, she even had enough money left over to buy a couple of smokes. This is the root of the destruction of the black family and the black community. Many of the problems that blacks face today have actually been created by welfare. Who’s boys do you think are running around terrorizing black communities and who’s girls do you think are having 4 and 5 babies by multiple different men? Kids of welfare black babymammas! It’s not politically correct but it’s the truth. The black community was once extremely stable in spite of abject poverty, Jim Crow, racism and discrimination. Illegitimacy was not their culture. As you all now have been taught to believe. It’s really a recent phenomenon. The social engineering of White elitist, feminist (the man is not NEEDED in the home) and progressive liberals who think they’re smarter than everyone else has done something that 400 years of slavery, Jim crow and discrimination were unable to do. Destroy the black family and black community.

  • Keep it Real

    Are you sure you’re a man? Getting pussy is one of the easiest things any man breathing can do. He doesn’t even need a legs, eyes or a job. So what’s your point….loser. Step your game up and try to accomplish a few other things in life.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    keep it real

    I’m not against Liberals, Socialist and liberal policies out of some stubborn ideology. I’m against them BECAUSE THEY DON’T WORK at least not in the hood.

    Basically you’re against welfare because it frees women from dependence on men. Or maybe you’re just against any kind welfare for blacks.

    If not then what other “liberal”, “socialist” policies are you against because they don’t work in the Hood?

    List them.

    When you’ve done that – explain the inconsistency in your ideas whereby – you’re against women having babies for poor black men, but you want to force them to be dependent on the same poor men.

    Doesn’t make any sense to me.

    :-)

  • Perspective

    Keep it real,

    I use to believe in this concept, but I’m going to tell you why it won’t work.

    First let me say, in theory it would work, because women are the limiting reagent. Sex and children don’t happen without women saying yes, unless their is rape (watch some woman bring that up like that’s what we’re talking about)

    Here is what I realized. Women are not going to do what you are saying because women truthfully have no business leading. They honestly are incapable of leading the black community any where. If they were capable then we’d be in a much better place.

    And true leaders, don’t blame the other party for their failed leadership.

    If black women want to say black men were terrible leaders, as if they were following us. I’d accept that.

    But I’ll be damned if they’re going to sit around make the claim that they’ve been running things, are the rock, foundation, and backbone but take none of the accountability for our correct collective condition.

    The Captain cannot blame the first mate – so we have to assess who’s really been the leader in the black community.

    And that goes back and forth – The truth is black women talk a lot of hot garbage. They will proclaim they are the leaders, but when its time to dish out accountability flee back to the enclave of their sudden inherent frailness and weakness after 15 minutes on the microphone talking about how strong, independent and resilient they are.

    The truth is women are INCAPABLE of raising boys to be men. Only men can do that.

    I say again – WOMEN ARE INCAPABLE. If they were it would have been done by now, no questions asked. If they could do it by themselves it would have been done. The women who say they can are just talking a bunch of BS. They like to stroke themselves to death and hear their own forces.

    It is literally up to men to fix this problem and the only thing we have on our sides are the fact that the women know the boys are failing and that they need to be mentored by men because women can’t contain them.

    Now. What a lot of women expect us to do is mentor these boys to be little sissy boys who pander, cater, and serve women or are MEN ON WOMEN’S TERMS.

    That is now what will be done. The boys are already here. So for those men who understand what true manhood is, these boy have to be taught true manhood, and IGNORE all the garbage women say, and build up their communities, AS MEN, to the point where black women would have no choice but to get with the program.

    RIGHT NOW – white men have bought black women from under us. They are not getting with what black men have because either black men have nothing to offer, don’t have a program, or what the white man is offering is BETTER.

    So they will insist on being strong and independent until WE AS MEN FIX THAT.

    Where I put my foot down on these women are those who think that while I’m trying to do what I need to do in my own life, and focus on building up the community, as ALL MEN SHOULD, that she’s just going to go out here and keep having babies with MR. Irresponsible who most likely came from a single parent home his damn self and think that I’m going to simply pick up the tab.

    IF IM BUILDING SHIPS FOR THE BLACK COMMUNITY, LAST THING I NEED ARE BLACK WOMEN DRILLING WHOLES IN THE BOTTOM.

    As much as boys need to be mentored, every additional boy that is thrown at me, is less time spent building and more time mentoring.

    Hopefully I’ll get some extra hands to help build while I’m building out of it, but we are talking over the course of 20 years. So all the time I spending teacher her son the qualities and skills that THE MOTHER SHOULD HAVE LOOKED FOR IN THE BIOLOGICAL FATHER TO BEGIN WITH – is time away from me putting something together with other black men.

    Just like black women say they can’t work and raise kids as a single parent at the same time – or how hard it is.

    We as black men can’t be juggling mentorship overload while being burdened with the task of repairing this community with ZERO COOPERATION FROM BLACK WOMEN. Who want to act a damn fool or be unaccountable adding to the problem until we get it nice and comfortable enough for her to finally take a sip of “B*tch act right!”

    Besides, when you’re out here busting us ass to get things done for the community or your people it doesn’t make you too enthused to want to grab on a sista for companionship when all they can say to you is. I’m gonna continue to act crazy until you completely fix the community to the point where it mirrors the white community.

    Black women seem to forget that the young black men out here were born into a messed up community just as they were but yet we are being charged with the burden and responsibility of fixing it as if we were actually here when the whole thing collapsed.

    Yes black men feel off, but we all know of the outside forces that assisted in that, and it should be understood that many of the black women of the past were instrumental in hitting the accelerator on the black communities down fall, contrary to matriarchy, black woman always the victims ideology.

    There are women out here poppin babies out like pez dispensers with irresponsible men and no resources or foreseeable future.

    These women have to be called out just as much as we have spent decades putting all blame on their male counterparts that were raised by single mothers in the absence of fathers who were unfit to be father in the first place (most of the time). Damn all the exceptions – KEEP THE CHANGE!

    Today’s black men who want to call themselves leaders need to create opportunities for other black men so that they can be fathers in the home, and head of the household, not just some economically crippled man for black women to compare themselves to and tout their superiority.

    That’s like a average student bragging about how much better they are than a retarded student. Compare yourself to someone who has achieved more than you, recognize, and humble yourself – but I already know we have a lot of black women that avoid men like that simply because they can’t claim superiority, NOT IN AN ESTABLISHED MAN’S PRESENCE. So they boost each other up, and compare themselves to the men they knew couldn’t compete with them, which is a whole ‘nother topic.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    LOL!

    I’M the loser??

    Well how come I’m not the one b itching online about who women sleep with –

    everyday

    pretending to be concerned about the black community when all it’s really about is that you can’t get none. Never met a sexually satisfied man who had anything but good things to say about women – Real.

    LMAO!

    For all my loserness I got three marriage proposals this past February 29th. How many did you get?

    Probably don’t even know what I’m talkin about.

    LMAO!

    smh

  • Socially Maladjusted

    real

    btw answer the damn questions I put to you above.

  • AnorexicBob

    “Single Mothers” are not damaged goods, but they are less desired than childless women. For most of us guys, kids, especially bastard kids are a major turn off. There really isn’t a such thing as a “single mother”, if she has kids, then she isn’t single and there lays the problem. As a childless man, i’m not looking to shoulder another man’s discarded baggage. A woman with children really can’t give me the time, energy and love that a childless woman can. In the cases of women with bastard children, that in itself is a red flag, it hints at irresponsibility. I’m not really into children and i’m especially not looking to provide for children that aren’t mine.

    “Single mothers” are not bad people, they just aren’t good long term mate material. I think “single mothers” should give up dating and focus on raising their offspring properly.

  • jackieM

    @ Keep It Real
    I 100% agree with you. And truth be told, the same thing is happening in the UK

    @Socially Maladjusted, you live in a country with the highest out of wedlock rates in Europe and studies have concluded that those on the dole are more likely to have children without fathers in the home.

  • Keep it Real

    *Well how come I’m not the one b itching online about who women sleep with –

    I don’t give a fyck who they sleep with. I’m only concerned about them fyking men who don’t give a shyt about them WITHOUT CONTRACEPTIVES. I’m concerned about kids from these hookups being abused/abandoned and left in CPS (child protective services) and then foster care, going to school and flunking out because of an unstable home. Then growing up to become and unskilled/unemployable adult who resorts to crime or welfare. That’s what I’m concerned about. Nothing else. They can fyck a different nyggah everyday as far as I’m concerned as long as they don’t turn around 10 years later complaining about…..can’t get a man/no good men.

    I don’t get into whether another man is sexually satisfied on not. Too much info f@ggot. Concern yourself with what’s going on in the U.K. because you don’t know what in the fyck your talking about when you talk on shyt that goes on in the hood. You’re worst than these elite white liberals and their social engineering programs using blacks as guinea pigs. Who then go back to live in their lily white communities with their husband/wife along side the majority of their neighbors in two parent homes. Shut the fyck up dude! You don’t know what you’re talking about when it comes to what’s going on in black communities in the U.S. Talk on what you know.

    *For all my loserness I got three marriage proposals this past February 29th. How many did you get?

    Did it make you fill special, b!tch. I wonder how many other men they proposed to on that day. Leap year proposals aren’t celebrated in the states that’s a UK thing. however, there is something a little more well known called Sadie Hawkins day, in the U.S.. Which again no one really takes seriously.

    You place your self worth on how much pussy you can get…..Yeah, you’re a loser. Grow up and get a fycking clue. Selfish little man walking around like freaking male peacock. It’s not all about you, homie.

  • jackieM

    @ Perspective and Keep It Real

    I agree with the both of you. Im a black woman and you can imagine how difficult it is to have an opposing point of view when majority of my friends, who are single mothers with deadbeat baby daddies, make excuse after excuse for their perdicaments. These are college educated women with homes, cars, traveling but a knack for choosing the biggest losers. And according to them the deadbeat daddy signs only came out when she was pregnant. Perspective,like you stated, it all boils down to choices. Certain men should be avoided

  • Keep it Real

    @Perspective

    I agree with everything you said. The only thing I’m asking from women is to stop having babies by a bum, player or thug who doesn’t give a shyt about them. I do not consider divorced women (shyt happens) and baby mammas the same. If a man loves the woman there’s a good chance he will love and care for the kid.

    This is really simplified… but I believe with stable families everything else will then start to repair itself within the community. Blacks folks have been on this earth and survived for thousand of years without social engineering retarding the roles of the traditional nuclear familial structure.

  • Keep it Real

    *Basically you’re against welfare because it frees women from dependence on men. Or maybe you’re just against any kind welfare for blacks.

    If not then what other “liberal”, “socialist” policies are you against because they don’t work in the Hood?

    I’m against any program that rewards irresponsible behavior. I have no problem with programs that help those who are trying to help themselves ie training for a skill or education. If welfare is used SHORT TERM to help an able bodied adult regroup and get on their feet that’s also ok in my book. We are dealing with generational welfare in the black community. As a matter of fact we’re now four generations deep none of them have ever had a job and if they did no longer than a few months.. Example great grandmother (49), grandmother (35), daughter (17), newborn (1 year). Heck when I think about it make that five generations deep.

    *When you’ve done that – explain the inconsistency in your ideas whereby – you’re against women having babies for poor black men,

    You can’t show me one post EVER where I’ve said a woman having a baby by a poor responsible man is wrong. If their married that’s a great thing. Hell, from 1900 to 1960 every black kid was born and raised by poor responsible MARRIED black men. The community was not dysfunctional and extremely stable.

  • Keep it Real

    To anyone concerned I AM NOT @Perspective. I’d like to say great minds think alike but I wouldn’t want to insult him with that sort of comparison. lol

    That is all…… thank you.

  • Ms. Terious

    i’m confused. are the same “men” going on about women being a moral compass the same ones b*tching about matriarchy? when the same men ranting about how all of the good in life rests on the decisions women make (because god forbid black men should do the right thing without someone wagging a treat in front of them) turn around and then say the reason sh*t is in a shambles is because black women don’t know how to shut up—that’s when i’m done. these negros on this site are beyond lost.

    fellas (keeping it real, perspective, etc.) you can’t have it both ways. either you want women to be the leaders or you don’t. you can’t in one breath shed a flashlight on your own weakness (i’ll only get an A in class if a woman tells me to and reinforces it by withholding p*ssy if i don’t) and then be mad in the next breath when we realize you all don’t do anything without being pushed. HELLOOOOOO, this is why black men get so little respect from black women. FOH with this nonsense! these resentment-filled arguments wreak of “i’m the overlooked, [so-called] good black who gets passed over for thugs and i’m mad.” you all have to get over those rejection issues.

    but let’s take some of this sacred male wisdom you spit on here and apply it to the flipside of the argument, if you’ll indulge me: why put so much social stock in the hands of women who you all claim are too stupid to make proper decisions about their own bodies? with all these black women chasing drug dealers and having random kids, wouldn’t now be a good time to take the reigns and rebuild what we black women have single-handedly destroyed? oh wait, that would mean you’d actually have to be responsible for something other than yourself. go figure. this patriarchal nonsense that puts all moral responsibility on women, while totally relieving men of any real responsibility and accountability, is exactly why so many black women think they can do everything on their own. whose fault is that? whose fault is it that many black men seem to have no obligation to anything, not even the children whose faces are almost identical to their own? this problem is way deeper than you dudes make it out to be. the black family is in crisis and you all think, as black men, that your time is better spent being hard on women instead of checking yourselves? yeah, ok…

    i appreciate how passionate you all are about this topic, boys. but it’s obvious that your hearts are not in a good place. you seem very bitter and even jealous that despite black women making poor decisions, they still hold their heads up and keep it moving. i know it’s not all your fault as the powers that be have made it so that you feel inferior to everyone, including “your woman” and instead of you all realizing and accepting how we really got here and the true cause of our disconnect, you play into (and regurgitate, no less) the rhetoric of your slave masters. and no, this is not the “blame the white man” part of the show. this is a “black get more props than me despite all unfavorable circumstances, self-inflicted or not, and you can’t take it” type of thing.

    i am in no way, shape, or form praising women who have chosen to sleep with and subsequently have children by men who are not stable, committed, or capable. i have nothing to gain nor prove here, as i am not a single mother, have never been pregnant, don’t even know what the inside of an abortion clinic looks like. i’ve had wonderful experiences with men and maintained my standard of quality with them, even when my father and other men in my family weren’t providing the best examples. but i know way too much about the human condition to buy this truckload of sh*t you dudes come in here with (and for the 100th time, why are y’all here?) i grew up around people who were hopeless. i’ve seen, up close, the bad decision making that comes with subconsciously feeling like you don’t deserve more in life [than being the baby mama of a social degenerate]. i know the young woman who thinks a baby is her only shot at real love. i know the woman who thinks babies are her meal ticket and will bat them out as often as she needs to for as long as her reproductive organs will allow, just so she can get that government check. i try to look at these women with a discerning eye instead of a judgmental one, because i often find that they all share the same pain. and who am i to sh*t on anyone’s pain? sh*t, i’m sympathizing with yours and you all tapped my last nerve 50 comments ago (another example of a black woman empathizing with a ninja who doesn’t deserve it? perhaps.)

    if you can’t see that this issue is something that rests in the hands of black MEN AND WOMEN, and that the issues that plague us are not just one gender’s problem, then you dudes are lost causes. to quote one of my favorite authors, “nobody chooses dysfunction, conflict, pain. nobody chooses insanity. they happen because there is not enough presence in you to dissolve the past, not enough light to dispel the darkness. you are not fully here. you have not quite woken up yet. in the meantime, the conditioned mind is running your life.” in other words, black men, wake up, shake your conditioning and go and raise your sons and daughters! recognize how we really got to this space because without that knowledge, you’ll never be able to offer viable solutions to these exhausting issues. i know you’ve been told a million times that you’re weak and incapable, but you only prove it when you refuse to address the man in the mirror and continue beating up on the little woman. it’s a cheap tactic and it’s not even original.

  • Rikki

    That’s it; I’m convinced of it now: Men are stupid. Men are stupid pigs. I’m going to be a lesbian. That’s it. WHY? Because of your statement, right here. Because you discount a woman because she is a single mother and not on her merits. Because you automatically assume that a single woman with no children is somehow going to give enough of a sh*t about you to want to give you her time at all.

    Because you can’t pull your thumb out of your a*ss to realize that people are people, and that whether someone has children or not does not make them any less of a person or long term mate material than anything. Because you would go so far as to pingeonhole a woman into the category of “mate material”. What the holy f*ck?!

    I mean, from what I learned from history, this type of crap has been going on for a long time, in cultures across the world, but ONLY here in America, do we have a group of men telling women that they are undesirable because of another man’s children, even though the institution of women being unfavorable because of that same fact was started by men. In accounts as old as the BIBLE, you have men demonizing women who were “single mothers” for lack of a better word, and were telling them that they had to be married to other, eligible men. That they would not be allowed to have property, pass on property ot their daughters, that they would not even have control over their own LIVES if they did not marry, that they would be considered loose women and Jezebels and whores, etc, etc. if they did not marry eligible men and produce children with them.

    But NOW, women are being called that and worse, but now we’re being demonized for being “single mothers” and doing what we were taught to do all along, what Bible thumping preachers had told us to do, banging on their pulpits and spitting out sermons. God, men are such assholes. I am SO glad I wasn’t born one and that I did not marry a one of you complaining, broke down negroes who want to blame JUST the woman for having sex without a contraceptive but do not want to EQUALLY lay blame at the feet of the men as well.

    Seriously? Because it’s ALL a woman, right? Men lack the brain cells to tell a woman, “hey, no. I don’t want kids. Are you on the pill? No? Well, sorry, but I got to run out a get a condom, naw’mean?” Like, it’s completely and totally ALL a woman, right? Like a woman has the power to say yes to who she sleeps with, but a man can’t say, No. So, you’re telling me that men lack that power? Then how the hell are you guys even TRYING to be leaders of this community if you can’t even say no to sex? Seriously?

    Yeah, I’m done, “community” (please detect my sarcasm). Call me when you get you ish together. Thanks!

  • Rikki

    THIS. RIGHT. HERE. ^^^^^ A THOUSAND TIMES THISSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!

    I would propose to you, but I’m a girl and I’m straight, but yes!

  • Ms. Terious

    @rikki

    shhhhhhhh! *whispers* don’t blow our cover, girl. they can’t find out that we’re a part of a left-wing feminist conspiracy aimed at castrating black men, stripping them of all their decision-making power by hypnotizing them with our evil vaginas. hahahaha!

  • Keep it Real

    @Ms. Terious

    Sorry, I didn’t read everything. “Moral compass” imo does not mean LEADER. Every industrialized nation in the world has embraced female contraceptives and the women have become empowered by it including educated black women. Poor black women in the hood are still in the dark ages when it comes to birth control. Condoms are good for prevention of STD’s and birth control for short term hookups. Condoms has never been an effective form of birth control for any nation or race. They’re not good form of contraceptive for long term consistently s3xually active relationships which is why every industrialized nation in the world has embraced female contraceptives. You’ve got women on these blogs saying they’ve used a condom every time they’ve had s3x and WE ALL KNOW IT’S A LIE. Which is why some young black girls think they’re going to be able to be s3xually active and exclusively depend on condoms for birth control. I’m not going to play that game the stakes are too high and you shouldn’t either. You all are setting these young girls up for failure asking them to do something that you were not able to do yourself. It’s not best but, two people consistently having s3x over a period of time, at some point during the relationship they are not going to use a condom as frequently or at all. This applies to probably 90 to 95% of the people of EVERY RACE. Why don’t you tell the truth.

    Learn the difference between sex for procreation and sex for recreation. I’m not saying don’t have sex. I’m saying sex at this point in society does not mean having a kid. Pregnancy is 100% preventable. I’m saying don’t have a baby by a bum who doesn’t care about you. Women decide who they will have sex with and who they will have a baby by. Black men and women are not having anymore nor less s3x, UNPROTECTED S3X, than men and women of other races, however, black women have 2 to 3 times the amount of abortions and illegitimate kids. Why?

    American Black Women are the only culture and race of UNMARRIED women in the WORLD including Africa who blame their pregnancy (he should have used a condom) on men. This is the end result of the liberal victimization ideology. Throughout history up to the present all other races and cultures hold the UNMARRIED women responsible for her pregnancy. There is a reason for that right or wrong, it works! Do you have a better Idea? Stop asking black men to do what no other race of men is willing to do. Marry, and raise a family with a woman they don’t give a sh!t about. Most of these black babymamma kids are from short term hookups with an immature bum, player or thug/convict. If you get pregnant by a bum, player or thug/convict, don’t expect him to change just because you had a baby. You knew who he was before you laid with him. You are responsible for your body, You!!!! And no one else! Too many black women are making stupid excuses about condoms for the reason they’re pregnant or had a baby by a bum. Yes the man is equally responsible for the baby but he is not equally responsible for the pregnancy. Good luck with equal responsibility from a bum, player or thug/convict. That’s your body. The courts have even given women the right to abort with or without the man’s consent.

  • jackieM

    @Rikki

    Before I married, I never dated men with children. No one has the right to tell another person what they should look for in a mate. If I want a childless man that’s my choice. Iwanted a marriage where my husband and I shared the joys of being parents for the first time. Besides, if a person has children how can they properly date without taking away time from their children? Also, my husband wouldnt have givien me the time of day if I had kids. It’s a choice; everyone doesnt want to be an automatic parent nor pick up the slack for another’s child.

  • Ms. Terious

    @keep it real, i’m not even reading your response. knowing you, i think it’s safe to assume i’ve read it a million times before. so *in my best philly girl accent* BYE BOY!! hahaha

  • Rikki

    See? And the problem I have with your statement @Presh, is that you assume some of the younger mothers KNOW that sex automatically leads to pregnancy. Some of the teen mothers DON’T know that because they are not being properly educated by their parents and any attempts by schools to teach them usually gets blocked by ultra-conservative groups who think that school ISN’T a place to learn that. Sex is still a touchy subject (as proven by a NUMBER of idiosos on this commenting section) in the U.S. and everyone just ASSUMES tha everyone should know automatically what they’re getting into.

    I’m not arguing for the sake of the older women (20 – 30) who have sex and have children, but the teen mothers? Nine times out of ten, they didn’t know.

  • Keep it Real

    Just stop lying to these young girls. => “You’ve got women on these blogs saying they’ve used a condom every time they’ve had s3x and WE ALL KNOW IT’S A LIE.”

  • Ms. Terious

    it’s obvious you cherry picked my comment because your response is completely irrelevant to what i said, but feel free to continue an argument with yourself.

  • AnorexicBob

    @ Rikki

    Stupid ?? I see nothing stupid about a man having standards. We know what we like and we have the right to pick the things we approve of and reject the things we don’t approve of.

    A woman’s children are her merits. They are part of her life, they reflect upon her, they consume her energy and time. She lives a lifestyle that is not compatible with mine. I’m not into children. I don’t want her children in my life, so that would limit her as well.

    frankly, you’re being overly emotional and very immature. U don’t know me from a hole in the wall but yet you’re taking this personal and hurling insults at people. I have the right to like what I like

    I’m sorry someone hurt you, but you can’t take that out on those of us that haven’t done anything to you. You’re projecting you’re issues onto us and it’s rather sad. No one claimed “single mothers” were bad, that’s u projecting your own insecurities onto us. No one is blaming women for anything. If a woman wants to have bastard children, then that’s her right and her business, but it’s also my right not to have anything to do with those children. I am a childless man by choice. Stop expecting the world to kiss the asses of single moms. You made the choice to have children, we made the choice not to have them. DON’T TRY TO FORCE YOUR CHOICES AND YOUR BAGGAGE ON US. We don’t want to deal with anyone’s bastard children, WHAT PART OF THAT DON’T YOU UNDERSTAND ?

    Furthermore, I am not a “broke down negro” , I am a middle class, biracial man, not that matters as this has nothing to do with ethnicity. This is about standards and the refusal of certain women to accept the fact that men have standards. No one is saying that you baby mothers are bad, we’re just saying we don’t find relationships with single mothers to be appealing. I have not discounted anyone as a person, I just don’t want to date them, that’s not the end of the world. Women like you need to get over yourselves, just because a guy doesn’t want to date you, doesn’t mean he has anything against you.

    We know what we like, get over it. If certain women want to breed bastard kids, that’s her right. She picked a lifestyle filled with children while many of us picked a CHILDLESS lifestyle. Men have pretty much always found women with bastard children to be unappealing (relationship-wise). Men all of races find this unappealing, yet for someone reason people expect men of color to accept left-overs. These women aren’t bad people, they just aren’t what we want in terms of a loving relationship. We men have the right to pick what appeals to us and we should not have to settle just because a lot of women don’t meet our standards. Women with bastard children made their choices, well let us men make our choices.

  • AnorexicBob

    @JackieM

    Obviously, Rikki thinks she can tell others (men) what we should desire and date. Sadly, A lot of blk woman try to guilt men into dating them when she discovered she’s part of the excluded group. It’s amazing , but many black women seem to be rather shocked that we have our own standards and preferences and many of them actually get offended when they discover they may not meet our standards.

  • RC

    “Men all of races find this unappealing, yet for someone reason people expect men of color to accept left-overs. ”

    well, you have no one to blame but yourselves for this one………

  • Perspective

    @ Ms. Terious – who says

    “i’m confused. are the same “men” going on about women being a moral compass the same ones b*tching about matriarchy? when the same men ranting about how all of the good in life rests on the decisions women make (because god forbid black men should do the right thing without someone wagging a treat in front of them) turn around and then say the reason sh*t is in a shambles is because black women don’t know how to shut up—that’s when i’m done. these negros on this site are beyond lost.

    fellas (keeping it real, perspective, etc.) you can’t have it both ways. either you want women to be the leaders or you don’”

    AFTER WEEDING THROUGH ALL THE BS

    ——-

    What you just said, and I’ve seen it before, illustrates exactly the problem with black women.

    HEAR ME OUT!

    You women have been operating so independently FOR SO LONG – that you don’t even understand the basics of incentives, or is that only when it comes to ya’ll.

    Bw – “we’re wear weaves because ya’ll black men chase light skin women with long hair”
    Bw – “we’re bleach cause ya’ll black men like light skin women”
    Bw – “we’re because all ya’ll negros like big women”

    You name it there is a reason that black women do it attached to a black man – EXCEPT!!!!! when it comes to her own financial success which she has been taught to use to position her in an economic position over men where she has the control and the power. (WHICH SHE CAN ONLY DO WHEN SHES WITH AN LESS ESTABLISHED MAN – HENCE AVOIDING MEN WHO ARE CLEARLY MORE ESTABLISHED) which leads to some! of the bad boy chasing – SOME! because these men are either off the books or NEED her more than she needs him.

    But back to incentives.

    How many men do you think would go to war if they weren’t told that there was some imminent threat to his country, family, or way of life. How many men do you think would go off to war if when soldiers died they didn’t give them the highest honors and bury them in SPECIAL cemeteries for fallen soldiers away from the civilian population. How many get lured into being a soldier just for what looks like the reward of “BEING ALL YOU CAN BE” and getting some sort of RESPECT AND ADMIRATION FOR THAT.

    Sound similar? Yes it should because it’s the same as Black women who like to dish out medals for being single mothers, but that’s a whole different story.

    What I was telling Keep it Real – is exactly what I already knew you and black women like you would do, which is go right to – OH SO U BLACK MEN AREN’T GOIN TO DO THIS AUTOMATICALLY – AHA! UR UNFIT TO LEAD!

    Which is why I say – black men need to just DO IT – but NOT on women’s terms which is what black women want.

    They want black male responsibility without male leadership. They want black male accountability without leadership.

    Do you know why CEO’s are the boss – because they bear the burden of responsibility. Women want men to take on the responsibility without the burden something that 50 year old Natalie said on this page – women like you seemed to overlook.

    NO MEN JUST DO THINGS “JUST BECAUSE”

    There is a purpose and a reason. Patriarchy has a purpose and a reason. You black women want to be a matriarchy or pseudo matriarchy go right ahead, just know that ALL MATRIARCHIES have been and were conquered by PATRIARCHIES.

    Which is what all this comes down to when talking about human evolution and why the things are the way they are.

    If you can’t understand allow this woman to help you

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlvMAS_20K4&context=C42328f3ADvjVQa1PpcFOxrw8WWNbZZ_Y_ok8DLb-eQjLc8pLw_AQ=

    Bottom line – women like you will find any excuse not to follow a man, but yet expect and want men to do all the bench work, then when they SHUT DOWN and DON’T because there is no reward – women like you will jump up and call him weak, or say that he should just automatically do based on your needs.

    MEN ARE MEASURE BY WHAT THEY DO!

    Women are measure by who they ARE! All a woman has to do is be a mother and she will be valued, protected, and the first one to be rescued from a burning building or sinking ship.

    But when women BREAK! the social contract between men and women or are resistant to reestablishing that contract – MEN SHUT DOWN – and the black community is what you get.

    The white community is just realizing this. The black community has been existing in it for the past 40 years.

    Your not going to get black men to go above and beyond when the proper structure is not in place and there is essentially NO REWARD from doing anything for your own ungrateful women who have patriarchy all twisted in their heads, believe in patriarchal benefits or male duties in patriarchy but not their roles as women, and don’t support the men who are doing the right thing, so that other young men see that there’s actually something in this.

    The stupid thing is the guys who ARE DOING the right thing aren’t just simply going to shut down and tare down their sand castle when you said that they’re bringing sand to your beach – THEY ARE SIMPLY GOING TO GO SOMEWHERE ELSE, WHERE THE STANDARDS AND QUALITIES THEY LEARNED ARE STILL INTACT AND GO WHERE THEIR STOCK IS HIGHER, FOR WHAT THEY DO.

    I don’t advocated it, because its a brain drain and only makes the lack of decent men in the community worse.

    BUT that is what they do. They hop the fence – and we don’t see them again. Black women seem to forget that in this country they don’t live in a vacuum. Women like you make the other side look SO appealing.

    The simple fact that we have to go through the basics with ya’ll is SO uninspiring.

  • Perspective

    “Bw – “we’re wear weaves because ya’ll black men chase light skin women with long hair”
    Bw – “we’re bleach cause ya’ll black men like light skin women”
    Bw – “we’re because all ya’ll negros like big women”

    Damn Im tired

    “Bw – “we wear weaves because ya’ll black men chase light skin women with long hair”
    Bw – “we bleach cause ya’ll black men like light skin women”
    Bw – “we’re fat because all ya’ll negros like big women”

  • RC

    ” THEY ARE SIMPLY GOING TO GO SOMEWHERE ELSE, WHERE THE STANDARDS AND QUALITIES THEY LEARNED ARE STILL INTACT AND GO WHERE THEIR STOCK IS HIGHER, FOR WHAT THEY DO.

    I don’t advocated it, because its a brain drain and only makes the lack of decent men in the community worse.

    BUT that is what they do. They hop the fence – and we don’t see them again. Black women seem to forget that in this country they don’t live in a vacuum. Women like you make the other side look SO appealing.

    lol, the interracial threat……. it always tickles me !!!

  • Perspective

    @ Keep it real.

    Like I said in theory it would work, and to be quite honest with any other race of woman it would work. But I will tell you why simply telling black women to pick better men won’t work aside from the fact that a lot can’t be reasoned with.

    - because black men don’t control much.

    Basically the women have to be forced into a corner to conform. Black men would have to become so economically powerful that welfare and free housing or money for college were like peanuts to black women, but right now – THAT BEATS a blank because black men aren’t providing anything.

    Other races of women would fall in line (with the idea that their communities didn’t completely collapse like the AA community) and there were still remnants of black men controlling something – but as I was saying they would fall in line because they are dependent on their men, and there are some benefits that come along with that.

    Black women are not dependent on black men, therefore any common sense approach presented by men can simply be thrown out by belligerent women because there is nothing forcing them to comply.

    Haven’t you noticed the STRONG BLACK WOMAN doesn’t like authority or structure – especially that coming from a black man. They’ve rarely ever seen it, and most have been taught not to trust it – thanks to scorned women – who planted the seeds of bitterness in their daughters who know nothing of life yet; I digress.

    Basically what you are saying is right about women picking better men. IT WOULD JUST BE TOO EASY FOR BLACK WOMEN TO DO. Not only that, but it gives them room to THINK that if the black community did become fixed that it was THEM ALONE THAT FIXED IT. See these women don’t have any understanding of incentives because they’ve have been operating so independently of black men that they can’t even understand the basics of incentives.

    They teach their boys women are perfect their teen boy goes out here and get steam rolled by girls his age as a young adult, and then he transitions to FBW – u know what that means.

    When people are taught to exercise a certain behavior that is deemed good, they expect to be rewarded for it, if they’re not rewarded, why up hold the code. Its always easier to do whatever you want than to have discipline.

    This was the point I made about praising single mothers, not putting them down, or uplifting them. I’m like – well damn! how the hell do you intend to uphold the idea that GETTING PREGNANT AND BECOMING A SINGLE MOTHER IS NOT OK!

    Why should the 15 year old girl wait till she’s married to have kids.

    Here’s comes Miss Terious – “SHE SHOULD WANT TO DO IT FOR HERSELF.”

    Ughhh yea, good luck with that one, especially when everyone is out here REWARDING BAD BEHAVIOR.

    Black women may complain about the Ray Rays, but Ray Ray damn sure never has a shortage of woman on deck – ADDRESS THAT!

    Again rewarding bad behavior. All these things are incentive related.

    Imagine being boss and telling everyone at work that you’re not going to pay them but they should still come in, because “its the right thing to do, be a productive member of society.” For all those who joined the military strictly for a job – go ahead and tell them to go fight for the country, risk life and limb, and say, “FIGHTING FOR YOUR COUNTRY IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO.”

    Now that’s MONEY – but everyone should get my point. Since it’s so easy to NOT do the right thing, or be complacent, this is why we teach our children to do the right thing and reward them.

    GOOD LUCK trying to get your 6 year old to get straight A’s and the importance of it while you are transitioning him to adulthood without ever rewarding him with something!

    Telling a sista to go NATURAL for herself because it’s the right thing to do, isn’t going to work either, if she thinks and feels no brothas are going to look at her.

    Like I said – women see INCENTIVES when THEY want to see them.

    Many really don’t care about what black men want.

  • Perspective

    @RC –

    No it’s not a threat. Black don’t take that threat seriously anyway, even that threat would work with other races of women because their men actually control something, and they are dependent on their men for their survival as women.

    I am simply pointing out an ever growing problem when it comes to the type of men who need to be mentoring black boys/men in the black community.

    Surely we don’t want to send the message to black boys – if we could ever get black men to mentor these youth – that all the black men who mentor have non-black wives – which on some level will suggest that “IN ORDER TO BE SUCCESSFUL YOU HAVE TO GET YOU A WHITE GIRL.”

    Picture that – all the men in the community that are mentoring and have some type of skills all have non-black women.

    I don’t know whether thats a slap in the face to BLACK MEN or to BLACK WOMEN.

    In any even where I know many of these men are being PUSHED! because black women don’t value MEN WHO ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING – and always want to charge the few – with what the most are doing (which I find funny because black women get mad when black men do that) but these men leaving is not a good thing when the black community needs to be repaired and these men are needed to mentor young black males.

    YA’LL WOMEN don’t see to care about that, but then you complain about the end result of what happens when men aren’t around.

    I swear some of you women are OUT OF YOUR MINDS and its unreal how the most basic concepts of how things should operate are meet with such resistance which is why any brotha that wants to hope the fence. I don’t get upset with him.

    I just simply shrug and give him the eye, “WE NEED YOU, BUT I UNDERSTAND,” and honestly the more I read women’s comments from this website the closer I get to washing my hands and absolving myself of all concern for the black community.

    I’ll just have to accept being on an Island somewhere fantasizing about the ZUMUNDA that will never exist do to people being irrational and too far gone.

  • Perspective

    @ RC -

    I don’t get this BLAME yourselves mess that black women like you keep coming with.

    Pretty much all the men that are commenting are young, below 30, childless men.

    Yet what your doing is charging them with the downfall of the black community, AS IF we were to blame it all on the black men of the past generation, that these men you are talking to now have anything to do with that.

    YOU NEED TO GET OUT OF THE PAST.

    When women start talking like that – I’m like – wellll nothing can be done – cause if you think your going to get young men to repair the community while throwing the black men of the past in their face simply because they share the same gender, EVEN THOUGH THEY CAME OUT OF A BLACK WOMAN’S WOMB.

    You’re out ur mind.

    The way you women detach yourself from your men when convenient is the GREATEST disloyalty I have ever seen, then women like you sit in little pow wow’s and talk about how black don’t back you up when white male cops punch ya’ll in the face.

  • Keep it Real

    You can debate an opinion you cannot debate a lie. It’s becoming increasing clear that the primary cause of illegitimacy is a pointless debate because men & honest/educated women are debating a lie. The black women who refuse to accept the notion that women are responsible for their body keep throwing up the “well he should have used a condom” excuse. These women are coming on blogs saying or inferring they’ve used a condom every time they’ve had sex. They’re telling black men (even in a long term monogamous relationship) to do something that no other race of men (AS A GROUP) in the world has been able to do. They’re telling teenage black girls to do something that THESE WOMEN WERE UNABLE TO DO THEMSELVES. Use a condom every time they’ve had sex. We all know this is a bold face lie. How can you have an honest debate that’s based on fraud? Black women stop lying to these young girls telling them that they’ll be able to use condoms exclusively as birth control until they get married or want to have a child. The truth is the amount of adults who have always used a condom every time they’ve had sex is no more than 5 to 10%. Tell these young girls the truth!

    I AM NOT ADVOCATING UNPROTECTED SEX. I’m just telling the truth. Yes, please always use a condom but let’s address the reality of sex.

  • CHE

    @Keep it Real/Perspective:

    So you stopped nation building,community and economic empowering AKA playing video games and scratching your balls long enough to come back here and disturb the peace, eh?.

    PISS OFF!.

  • CHE

    @Ms.Terious

    Please stop talking sense(I know) and please stop trying to have rational discussions with the irrational.

    That is all.

  • Socially Maladjusted

    @Real

    For f uck sake Real – please stop the b itch assness man.

    LMAO!

    Stop it!

    stop being a hater man, look if you’re ever in the UK, look me up, I’ll take you around the sights of London -

    Boho Thug London.

    LOL!

    If you’ve got a kool, yanki accent you know, like – “Y’all Brit niggaz is a trip” – and all that ebonics shit, these dumb b itches would be wettin themselves to get at ya.

    See I’m a hater too. LOL!

    But I can handle that coz it’ll add an 5 extra points to my swag meter, swishin around with a cool Yanki bwoy. But you have to come all thugged out.

    Don’t come all clean cut and preppy, wiv a f ucking bow tie, and pants belted around your waist – not cool, gotta be saggin. all the way. lol!

    And don’t come all Carlton Banks chattin bout – what you chattin bout.

    That would get us bofe tarred and feathered and run outta town.

    Just come dirty but

    Yanki hot.

    LMAO!

    Btw that invite goes out to any big booty yanki sista – wide hip small, waist style and cute. But the same goes for you too, don’t come if you’re a Claire Huxtable clonette.

    pfft.

    ya boring. and ya prolly aint got no arse.

    :-)

  • Perspective

    1 MORE TRY @ Ms Terious

    {Side note} Again its back to the classic argument of black men manning up
    1) Ignoring who’s raising the boys to men
    2) Male responsibility without male leadership or oversight – basically black men build the ship – but black women captain it because even if black men build a ship we’re not trust worth to sail it, hence a lot of the “well then the hell with building a ship.” “you got this ur a strong black woman”
    3) Since women don’t trust or believe in male leadership they will AVOID men who wield that type of power or are in a position of leadership justifying why they won’t follow him, or don’t respect him charging a man who literally just got himself established and can minimally take on a family with why he shouldn’t be followed by using the condition of the whole community against him making the claim they won’t follow him unless he and the few other men like him totally repair it. For a lot of women that is simply stalling against what they don’t want in the first place. Black women have not been dependent for so long that they don’t want to go back to being dependent on black men EVEN IF it was beneficial to them. That is a reality that they simply can’t see, because so far for the past 40 years any significant improvements to the black community have all been talk. I was asked what would fathers in the home and being the head do, it won’t create opportunities. My response, correct, but it would set the tone for the type of men that these boys should become building upon the model of what these young boys are seeing from their fathers. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO HAVE MEN BUILD – GROWING UP SEEING NOTHING BUT WOMEN IN CHARGE!!!!! Women need to get this crap out of their head that boys are going to MAN UP in a MATRIARCHAL community, where everywhere you look all you see are women in charge. So then we get into the pissing match of, do women need to stand down, or do men need to stand up. If women stand down, then that gives them room to say – well ya’ll are so weak that we have to stand down – SAD, but the man up model doesn’t work either because many black women don’t want to go to a model of a community where black men wield that type of power. They ideally want on point SISSY. Black male businessmen that go out into the community build it up, but come home and put on their skirt and follow her lead. THAT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. This is where the fence jumpin’ to other races of women once the men get it together really comes in. This is what many women don’t talk about, they simply go to the white beauty standard and the promotion of non-black women as eye candy and prizes on the arms of successful men. They will never talk about how they have little to no faith in following a black man, especially at the individual level. They will charge him with what the community of black men haven’t done as if those are his goals that he hasn’t meet. They are correct he needs to focus on that, but to hold the individual man accountable for what’s transpired in the community before he was even born is absurd. From what I’ve seen its an excuse not to get with a black man’s program and women ultimately want black men to BE MEN and MAN UP on black women’s terms.

  • Perspective

    ” That is a reality that they simply can’t see, because so far for the past 40 years any significant improvements to the black community have all been talk. I was asked what would fathers in the home and being the head do, it won’t create opportunities. My response, correct, but it would set the tone for the type of men that these boys should become building upon the model of what these young boys are seeing from their fathers.”

    one more thing @ Ms. Terious

    Women will tell me that they’re giving their man the chance to man up and they’re following a man in HOPES that he will man up.

    I would tell a woman to avoid that situation.

    Find a man who already has a foundation, and collectively avoid men who don’t – THIS SENDS A STRONG MESSAGE, just as strong and Dope boys being surrounded by women sends a strong message to boys as to the type of men they should be, or all the attention young girls get for shaking their booty.

    Only difference is the boys just want to sleep with those girls – ask them about marriage and those are the last girls they want to marry, unlike when it comes to women who

    KEEP TRYING TO FIT SQUARE PEGS IN ROUND HOLES!

    If he ain’t got it together or isn’t on the right path by 25 chances are he’s not going to be. For your sake and the sake of all the unborn children – please move ON.

    Yea, I know that’s a lot of brothas that you would be throwing away. So be it. We don’t need any more fatherless children out here.

    And we you getting with him only supports his shiftlessness and complacency. You can’t shame or BROWN BEAT a man into MANHOOD.

    it’s either on their hard drive or it is not.

    All males who have become MEN – had SOME POSITIVE MALE ROLE MODEL IN THEIR LIFE – FATHER OR NOT!

    If they NEVER had that – you can pretty much hang it up on a guy.

    STOP TRYING TO FIT SQUARE PEGS INTO ROUND HOLES – then turning around coming across and established guy and then telling him – how you’re never going to follow another black man again or trust a man to lead again because YOU CHOSE A DUMMY TO FOLLOW AND GAVE IT A SHOT AND IT DIDN’T WORK.

    I didn’t tell you to follow a dummy, ladies – DAMN!

    There is a such thing called discernment. The best thing you can give your children is a good father, but I’m simply not seeing THE CHILDREN being the big concern to most black women.

    If they were, there would be a lot more decisions made to not have children based on the lack of resources for children that exist in the community, or lack of men who minimally have to tools to take on a family.

    As educated as sistas claim to be, which most are not, I see women with children, and then I find out who the father is, I’m just like – REALLY!?

    …[PAUSE]… REALLY!?

    and you want me to blame him? Really?!?

    You expect me to believe that 5 years ago – he was just amazing, going somewhere, and had it so together, but when you got pregnant he just suddenly busted a 180?

    Come on chick – who you fooling.

    Again women thinking that they can fit ROUND PEGS INTO SQUARE HOLES – or that a CHILD-MAN is going to MAN-UP and become a MAN-MAN just because responsibility hits and you’re pregnant.

    If there were no opportunities before, what makes up think there going to suddenly show up just because you’re pregnant? If he didn’t have a job before, what makes you think that all of a sudden, all the planets are going to align now?

    As many things impact the black community from the outside – we really just have a lot of people not thinking, both men and women, – but the part that gets me – are the women PLACE ALL THE BLAME ON THE MEN when,

    1) The women aren’t selecting the right men, and there’s tons of evidence to show that they aren’t really thinking about the importance of the father for all various reason
    2) the women are raising the boys – the boys see no male leadership because there is no father there, or the man who is there ISN’T A LEADER
    3)Black women continue to keep teaching their daughters to be strong and independent for the preparation of the shiftless, lazy, unaccountable, do nothing black men, but say nothing of how they should behave or how to recognize a brotha that has it together. They only realize that after they have the baby by Mr. Wrong – then at 35 want an upgrade, and can’t figure out why Mr. Just Graduated from an HBCU with his Masters ain’t looking at her, and is looking at the Hispanic girl who’s just as submissive as ever and all about sailing on a brothas ship, as long as he’s cruising and the ship is solid she is down. There is no – “WELL JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE A SHIP, DOESN’T MEAN THAT I HAVE TO GET WITH YOUR PROGRAM OR BOW DOWN TO YOU (if that’s objective?)” These brothas hear that, whether the woman has a kid OR NOT, and are gone.

    Whats the issue with them leaving? There goes your current generation of mentors who need to be in the community TEACHING all these boys with out fathers how to be men, or creating opportunities in the black community so that all these boys EVEN IF MENTORED, have something to walk into to be able to support their families as men when they actually come of age and get there.

    It not just about mental preparation its also about establishing something to that he can actually exercise the traits, qualities, and characteristics that he’s been taught.

    I try, but every time I explain this – I run into the wall of resistance with black women.

    I’m like, well, has the way BW been operating been working for them, or the community? If so, what’s up with all the COMPLAINING?!

  • jackieM

    @AnorexicBob

    Im a woman and before marriage I found that many men didnt accept my unwillingness to date them b/c they were baby daddies. For the same reasons you wish to not date single mothers, were the same reasons Ichose not to date baby daddies.

  • Ms. Terious

    not sure why my comments aren’t showing on here, but whatevs *shrugs*

  • Ms. Terious

    *note: i posted this earlier, but for whatever reason, it never made it to the comment section*
    lord it’s too early for shenanigans. lol… actually this is good for me. debating moot points with people who don’t get it keeps me entertained, so here goes it…
    fellas (you know who you are), i beg you to please peep the contradictions in what you’re saying. while you admit that black men haven’t done their part you then turn around and say “but it’s because women won’t let us” WEAKKKKKKKKKKKK! come on boys, you all can’t see this is a deeper issue than you’re making it out to be? you really want to play this blame game and think you’re winning? *sigh*
    the only reason i’m engaging you is because that’s what these comment sections are for. if i keep pointing out all the flaws in your arguments, i’m going to come across as a black man basher and that couldn’t be further from the truth. it’s because of my deep love and respect for black men that i don’t hesitate to call bullsh*t when i hear it coming out of their mouths or, in this case, read it in the comment section of a black women’s blog.
    you all can copy and paste the stats and say the same thing over and over again, but it still won’t change the fact that you are short-sighted, narrow-minded and quite delusional to boot. you will never and have never spoken to young men in the hood about not laying down with the “neighborhood ho”, let alone get her pregnant. i bet everything i have that you don’t have the cojones for that. let me let you in on a little secret. some women are hustlers. they know black men can’t turn down p*ssy and they use it to get what they want. too often, black men, having little self worth, fall for anything that comes with the promise of busting a nut. incentive? really? one of you actually compared accolades for military service to reasons why men don’t take care of their children? wow. i’m sure a soldier would smack the sh*t out of you for trivializing what they deal with. here’s a newsflash: taking care of children is not a prison sentence or a tour of duty! y’all ninjas are so selfish and nothing more than children your damn selves so of course you would liken something as serious as fighting to protect a country to taking your son or daughter to the movies. have a f*cking seat, please! you sound crazy.

    then you all go on about the perils of matriarchy which has NEVER existed in history. let me repeat that MATRIARCHY HAS NEVER EXISTED IN HISTORY. you name me one time in history when women ruled? i’ll wait… so you see, my loves. you don’t even know enough to have this conversation. what you’re doing is projecting and as i said before shedding light on your own weakness and inability to deal in situations that aren’t “perfect” by your definition.
    now, let me be clear. i am not sh*tting on anyone’s preference not to date someone with children. i don’t have kids so that’s not my issue. i don’t blame you all one bit. but this stopped being about that a long time ago. some sh*t is just too obvious. if you don’t want to date a woman with children, don’t. who cares if they don’t like that you don’t like them because they have children. are you really concerned about what these women think of you? do you really think your pontificating on women you will never date is helping anyone? it’s not. you are no more valuable to the black community than the drug dealer and the baby mama. you bring nothing to the table, not even a fresh idea, let alone a fresh approach to longstanding problems. you all think the woman shaming in the middle east, a part of the world that has been in constant turmoil since its existence, is a viable tactic? or asia, where many discard baby girls on the side of the road because they’re the least desirable sex? smh. i won’t go any further with that. that level of insanity shouldn’t even be played with.
    you guys have made every apples and oranges comparison you could pull out of your asses. and since you insist on reaching way across the pond for irrelevance, here is something that you all might find interesting:

    “Worldwide, of the 14 developed countries studied, the highest unwed birth rates were among the Scandinavian nations.” -USA Today

    oh wait? white women have children out of wedlock? in large numbers? *clutches pearls*

    “Claude Martin, a sociologist who is a professor at the Institute of Political Science in Rennes, France, said: ‘Here in France there is very little difference between being married and cohabitating, and very little difference between children born out of wedlock and those that are born within marriage.’” –Business Library

    “In Scandinavia, highly complicated living and custodial arrangements between partners, children and former couples, are common. ‘We have little commitment to the institution of marriage, but we do have a commitment to parenthood,’ said Kari Moxnes, a 57-year-old professor of sociology at the University of Trandheim…” –Business Library

    so you see, if i wanted to pull random factoids that make black men look incapable of simply sticking around to be there for their children (not their mothers), i could. but i know that what goes on in other parts of the world has nothing to do with the problems that face black people over here, i also know that the issues we face are extremely unique and can’t be oversimplified by your shallow arguments. your hate for black women is way too apparent, boys. you all take this sh*t way too personal. perhaps your own mothers made poor decisions that affected you negatively. i don’t know, but what i do know is you all have to get off of youtube and google and get some real education.

  • iris

    Taren isn’t mentioning that she was a jumpoff of one of the guys in the business she used to be in. this was as recent as 2years ago. the guy repeatedly told her they were not together and that he was not her man yet she keeps claiming he was. She was calling, texting, e-mailing him until he changed his number and every thing. Taren that is your problem right there you have to know the difference between just being a fuck and being a girlfriend. You should never have made any comments about this topic no wonder you disabled the comment box yet you say that when people make truthful comments about you it does not bother you, yeh right.

    Taren if you were to have kept your legs closed you would not have 3kids for 3 different fathers and I do agree that is a major red flag. the nerve of you to say that men are not equipped to handle a single mother, I beg the differ. Men can handle a hard working, and true single mom but they just can’t handle a whore like you and that’s the truth. If a man loves you regardless of what baggage you are carrying he will be willing to make it work NO excuses, but if you are always so easy and have no class selling yourself all the time no man is going to wife you. On top of that you had had you boys taken away from you and was givin custody to their fathers family all because you were running the streets is very sad. You weren’t even married when you had your 3rd child like come on when are you going to get the big picture? Then you want to blame the men and say that they are not equipped? Bitch go sit the fuck down and close your fucking legs. NO wonder you don’t do the business anymore which is not a surprise because everybody knew that you’s a whore. The guy in the business that used Taren for what she is said that she was still attempting to reach out to him saying that someone broke into her house so he changed his number again a second time. I don’t know if She is still contacting him because he doesn’t mention it when I see him at the meetings, but that just goes to show how Low Taren Guy is willing to go. The guy has moved on back with his wife and she is still trying to get with him. Taren was also contacting other men in the business that also used her as a jumpoff but she is not going to mention that in her videos.

    I too was a single mom and I joined this business to help myself and make a better future for my kid. I have kept my standards very high after my a kid prior to marriage, along with birth control and I don’t have 3 kids with 3 different fathers. I have been married for 4years now and I am now considering having my second child. Everyone has their own story but you have control as a person to make a better ending if you didn’t get a good start. I have learned from my past mistakes and I moved forward for the better but damn there are just people out there to live up to the statistics of our disgraceful society.

    As for this topic I stand corrected when I say NO not all single moms are damaged goods. There are single moms out there that actually live up to the title as a mother and that is not just because they have brought kids into this world, but because they love and care for their kids like I care for mines. We are not tramps or whores nor jumpoffs or home-wreckers or attempted home-werckers Like Taren Guy. We are the minority of what true single moms are but the majority people like Taren Guy here is what gives us true single moms a bad name. Ho sit the fuck down clean up your act, stop trying to be someone you are not for God sakes you have 3kids now why don’t you try to break the cycle? I feel sorry for her kids they are the ones that are going to suffer the most and it’s so sad because they did not ask to be here with a mother like Taren. It’s probably better for the kids to be with their father’s family, they might have a chance after all.

  • Iris

    Taren isn’t mentioning that she was a jumpoff of one of the guys in the business she used to be in. this was as recent as 2years ago. the guy repeatedly told her they were not together and that he was not her man yet she keeps claiming he was. She was calling, texting, e-mailing him until he changed his number and every thing. Taren that is your problem right there you have to know the difference between just being a fuck and being a girlfriend. You should never have made any comments about this topic no wonder you disabled the comment box yet you say that when people make truthful comments about you it does not bother you, yeh right.

    Taren if you were to have kept your legs closed you would not have 3kids for 3 different fathers and I do agree that is a major red flag. the nerve of you to say that men are not equipped to handle a single mother, I beg the differ. Men can handle a hard working, and true single mom but they just can’t handle a whore like you and that’s the truth. If a man loves you regardless of what baggage you are carrying he will be willing to make it work NO excuses, but if you are always so easy and have no class selling yourself all the time no man is going to wife you. On top of that you had had you boys taken away from you and was givin custody to their fathers family all because you were running the streets is very sad. You weren’t even married when you had your 3rd child like come on when are you going to get the big picture? Then you want to blame the men and say that they are not equipped? Bitch go sit the fuck down and close your fucking legs. NO wonder you don’t do the business anymore which is not a surprise because everybody knew that you’s a whore. The guy in the business that used Taren for what she is said that she was still attempting to reach out to him saying that someone broke into her house so he changed his number again a second time. I don’t know if She is still contacting him because he doesn’t mention it when I see him at the meetings, but that just goes to show how Low Taren Guy is willing to go. The guy has moved on back with his wife and she is still trying to get with him. Taren was also contacting other men in the business that also used her as a jumpoff but she is not going to mention that in her videos.

    I too was a single mom and I joined this business to help myself and make a better future for my kid. I have kept my standard very high along with birth control and I don’t have 3 kids with 3 different fathers. I have been married for 4years now and I am now considering having my second child. Everyone has their own story but you have control as a person to make a better ending if you didn’t get a good start. I have learned from my past mistakes and I moved forward for the better but damn there are just people out there to live up to the statistics of our disgraceful society.

    As for this topic I stand corrected when I say NO not all single moms are damaged goods. There are single moms out there that actually live up to the title as a mother and that is not just because they have brought kids into this world, but because they love and care for their kids like I care for mines. We are not tramps or whores nor jumpoffs or home-wreckers or attempted home-werckers Like Taren Guy. We are the minority of what true single moms are but the majority people like Taren Guy here is what gives us true single moms a bad name. Ho sit the fuck down clean up your act, stop trying to be someone you are not for God sakes you have 3kids now why don’t you try to break the cycle? I feel sorry for her kids they are the ones that are going to suffer the most and it’s so sad because they did not ask to be here with a mother like Taren. It’s probably better for the kids to be with their father’s family, they might have a chance after all.

  • kia

    Seriously Taren? you’re that desperate? I just have one question. Why did you closed the comment box? That very suspect, and all it tells me is that you are nothing but damaged goods. Clutch magazine shouldn’t be trying to enable this kind of behavior. Baby mama with 3 kids and 3 differenT BABY DADDIES is really not the norm and it should not be over looked.

    This just my opinion for all baby mamas, If men don’t want you because you have 3 kids with different baby fathers or kids period, you cannot be bitter and upset. These men made a choice NOT to have kids out of wedlock, but you baby mamas chose to sleep with every man that walks and then you have a baby by them. Men too have standards and if they don’t want to become automatic fathers to your bastard kids don’t come on the internet and say that they are not equipped.
    Where was all this talk and sensitivity when you became a repeat offender 3times over. you had 3 kids with different fathers men are going to judge you by that and rightfully so.

    This is becoming a real issue in the black community and it is not right that you baby-mama are try to force this down our throats as the norm. This baby mama syndrome creates problem kids. These same kids will most likely continue the cycle of poor choices and thus have more kids out of wedlock. It is NOT OK that females are getting pregnant and having babies by these guys. Guys are to blame too but the woman can take so many forms or Birth control and the MORNING after pill. There are so many way to prevent pregnancy, but these women set men up and intentionally get pregnant hoping to get a relationship out of a short term hoop up or an unstable relationship. You females are a bunch of idiots. You deserve to be condemned and be ridiculed and embarrassed, you guys knew what the consequences of bringing a baby into this world without getting married. YOU BABY MAMAS CHOSE TO BE SHITTED ON otherwise you would have opted for a preventative.

    You guys want these men to come and shovel your shit when you should have been doing better to avoid the shit in the first place just like some of us childless women and childless men. Men won’t and shouldn’t not have to come along and be a father to kids that is not his own. Baby mamas being resentful and bitter, saying that men are not equipped is just a pathetic cry for a hoe that realized her face in permanently in the dirt.

  • AnorexicBob

    “well, you have no one to blame but yourselves for this one………”

    BULLSHIT !!! I have no part in this madness. I’m not a bastard breeder and I will not take part in the bastard culture that many blk engaged in. I have not contributed to the problem and I refuse to take part in such dysfunction.

  • jen

    If he had a child with her then he has a moral, emotional, legal, and financial responsibility to those children. None of us should judge others unless we’re walked in their shoes.

  • simone

    what kind of idiot are you? they knew exactly what they were getting into! and if you want to talk about ratios then 9 out of 10 are REPEAT OFFENDERS. They don’t have one kid but the go on to have another and another. Case in point look at the repeat offender that made that video? Do you really think Taren Guy did not know? Negro Please!!! Shut to hell up.
    I’ve never really understood you fools that are so oblivious to these out of wedlock, failed anchor babies, child-support and welfare having single baby mama’s. They know exactly what they are doing. There are some females that will intentionally set a man up into having a kid. What they want is another handout that comes our of our tax paying money and that’s just wrong.
    I am positive if they take away child-support and welfare they’ll find a way to protect themselves from having kids. I bet it will be slim to none.

  • simone

    I agree 100% Clutch magazine knows that this is a touchy subject and it is so sad that instead of stating the real issues of why society has to accept this belligerent and no-moral or value having behavior, they are supporting it just to get some extra cash in.
    Clutch Magazine is willing to suffer their integrity for growth. That is bad bad business. Have you guys seen what they have up lately? shiiiiz

  • simone

    100% on point. I love love what you are saying and it speaks volumes. People don’t want to hear it but it is the truth.

  • simone

    you are making excuses for her and if she was such great arm candy uhmmm where is the man? Where’s the ring? oh im sorry how about where is the relationship to begin with? I also had an unofficial poll that said Taren is a trap, and if the only reason they would fuck her is if they had a vasectomy because she is trying to get her baby daddy #4 on. They didn’t care what she looked like, and to them she is nothing but color they said something is off with her mouth area. So for you to say that she is gorgeous lets be honest do you think any man is really trying to get with her and take care of her 3kids with 3 baby daddies?
    My guy friends also said that if all them daddies didn’t stay that is a sign for running in the other direction.

    Stop making excuses for Taren and other baby mamas. She made a Choice to have unprotected sex out of wedlock. If she didn’t want to be shot down, she should have closed her legs, or use condoms and birth control, get married, go to the abortion cinic or something. When she opened that whole in her face like she opened the one between her legs she was OPEN for ALL COMMENTS. UNLIKE her video comment box, Clutch magazine did not disable their comment box, but Taren Guy did. I wonder why……

  • Sonia

    “he has a moral, emotional, legal and financial responsibility to those children. None of us should judge others unless we’re walked in their shoes”

    Taren is that you lol or you must be another baby mama lol

    you are a lil bent behind these comments. I have a question did you turkey baste your baby daddy? or did you break the condom?

    When you guys met these men you were probably not in a committed relationship and you attempted to make him commit by getting pregnant. Then you try to force the man to be a father lol. The truth is you knew what you were getting into when you opened your legs and if you went on a ‘one man-mission’ to intentionally get pregnant then that’s on you. Now don’t get me wrong there are some grimy men out there, but guess what, We as women have all control that is why they created birth control that is 99% effective!!!
    Had you baby mamas been on Birth control single baby mamas with multiple kids and baby daddies would not be a NEGATIVE issue today. Single baby mamas and baby daddies alike would be such a low percentage and NOT the self proclaimed NORM.

    Don’t come on here talking crap about don’t say nothing if we haven’t walked in your shoes because the Fact is we don’t want to walk in your shoes that is why were are childless or married with children. Maybe if you would have had some MORALS you wouldn’t be making comments supporting BABy Mamas!

  • Jen

    Wow, you sound angry. Good luck with life.

  • Bev

    I’m late to the party but i just gotta say that this is by far one of the saddest sets of comments I’ve ever seen on here. Just shameful. I absolutely agree with the person who said that a lot of the people are more damaged than any single mother…hurt people hurt people I guess. The internet can be such an ugly place.

    I really dont get the difference between being in a committed relationship that ends and being married only to get a divorce. Divorce rates are at an all time high so marriage is clearly not as sacred as people would like to make it out to be (and people get divorced for all kinds of reasons)

    Relationships don’t always work out. I find it even more interesting how people tend to overlook the fact that A LOT of our elders were raised by “parents” that did not actually create them. A lot of the time these things were not spoken of….a lot of yall may want to double check your family tree before you turn your nose up at others. The negativity being thrown around is disappointing to say the least. Especially when it comes from people who im sure aren’t perfect themselves

    For what its worth i know plenty of single moms who have found love and have dated wonderful men who were single fathers themselves. Some of the stories these men would tell me about the selfish women that would give them hell about spending time with their child were just disguisting. Its ok to have a preference but i personally would never turn away a good man because he has a child….i definitely wouldnt consider them to be “damaged goods”

    I hope that the people in here that are full of negativty find some peace. I cant even comprehend that kind of talk and where you have to be on a personal/emotional level to even think such things let alone type them

    And for what its worth I’m pretty sure that taren has 3 kids by two men. She actually has a pretty inspiring story. People should maybe tey to focus on the good before attacking somebody that they dont even know. A lot of people wouldnt be able to make it through all she has with a smile on their face and the ability to remain positive

  • lovelydove

    It’s unreal the comments made by these so called women! The only dammaged goods are these potty mouth females!!!!

  • Kay Marie

    Wow! I dont know Taren personally but I do know if what she did in her past is true….it’s.her PAST! Let him or should I say “her” who’s NEVER did anything wrong cast the first stone.We’ve all made stupid mistakes, & wrong decisions. It’s a trip how people attack and jump down someone else’s throat and act like they’re perfect.I really hope when you all who’s callin the girl out her name and telling her business need compassion and forgiveness it’s given to you b/c you reap what you sow. If you show someone mercy (mercy is what you get when you dont deserve it…instead of getting the punishment) if you show someone mercy and forgiveness then you’ll get it when you need it. If you dont…you wont. God loves and forgives Taren and He loves and forgives you

  • Curly1

    You know, some of you make it sound like Taren had kid after kid, after kid. Sounds like she took a 6-7 year break before she had her last one. maybe she learned a few things during her journey. I only recently followed her on YouTube, so I don’t know her story. And I don’t care. she’s a working single mother, whose lifestyle I’m not paying for with my tax dollars. She’s got an org going that addresses autism in the community. That’s a good thing, IMO. Those throwing shade on her, what are YOU doing?!

  • Niccy

    It’s actually disgusting to hear the amount of hate going around. Just because she has kids, it doesn’t mean that she’s a slag. From her videos it’s obvious she loves her kids and they seem happy. For all you know, she could have only been with her baby daddies her entire life. She’s not perfect, I’ve never heard her say that she is, but some of you people here are going around like your mess doesn’t stink, as if you’ve never made mistakes. Life happens. You also forget that the US is shit when informing teens about birth control options (abstinence is the leading method taught, still).

    There are plenty of people born to people who are married who are messed up. The fact that your parents have a piece of paper does not mean that you are better than any of us ‘bastards’. It doesn’t make us any less worthy of love or our mothers ‘damaged goods’. My mother was young when she had my sister and I and before you go in on her, know that my siblings and I have always been ahead of the class because of her. We have principles because of her. My mother’s a decent woman and when she was young, she chose the wrong man to commit to. Being a single mother does not mean you are a slut. There are plenty of loose women without children. There are people like my mother who were in a committed relationship with their first love who get pregnant. And you know what? My siblings and I are not any worse off because we were not born in wedlock. I’m actually far more well rounded than people I know who were born in wedlock. The point that I’m making– the quality of parenting lies in the parent, not in their marital status.

    And I’m more inclined to think that people who go around spreading hate and negativity are more apt to be labelled ‘damaged goods’ because you people are damaging. Those of you who are looking down on Taren are doing so to make yourselves feel better and I personally do not think that a) you have any right to judge and b) your priorities are skewed. Having your opinion is one thing and your preferences another but to ostracise a group of people without taking anything else into consideration like the quality of the person and how they treat their kids (which is the most important thing) shows a ridiculously simplistic view of the world. If some one is doing their best by their kids then they deserve your respect. Two people find parenting hard. If one person is doing it by themselves and their kids are well cared for and happy then they too deserve your respect; more so actually because of how hard parenting is.

    I understand why some people would not want to go for someone who has children already but rather than because they’re ‘damaged goods’ (who on earth came up with that horrible phrase anyway?) but because it’s a LOT of responsibility taking on someone else’s kid and I don’t think that anyone should take it lightly because there are children involved and they are the most important component of the equation.

    Do not get me wrong. I personally want to be married first but only because I have the opinion that if I’m going to be bound to you forever by having your child, you can make a vow to me to love me for the rest of my life. Having a child is a far bigger commitment.

  • http://twitter.com/CaliforniaLA August Theo (@CaliforniaLA)

    Rikki, what a sexist bitter tirade.

    You’re going to “be a lesbian” based on one man’s post? You call all men stupid because of one man’s post?

    More than likely you already hated men and were already bitter towards men before his post, and are using his post as an excuse to go off the deep end. One post would not completely change your sex life and outlook on life. More than likely you’ve had unsuccessful relationships, are currently single, and need to blame men without taking responsibility yourself. Maybe you should also take a look at what’s wrong with you.

    You act like women can’t be “assholes.” You’re just playing the victim card while being an asshole yourself.

  • Ghana

    Ummmm what does she have? She lives off of child support and Autism money off of her kids don’t judge if you have no idea of what the true story is. I live right in the same building and I’ve seen for myself. Even before she started that autism org So please stop showing this heffa she is doing good she is doing it for self. As she did before and she has the nerve to come out her and be mad about brothers not wanting her. I don’t have 3kids and if I did that would be up to that person to accept me ill never try to force it down ppls throat. She’s damaged goods to me 3kids and she is definitely a slut. Trust me!

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